Hi again. If you last post was a response to me then we seem to be miscommunicating. But no worries, what I was questioning is academic in regards to at what point a level of certainty is achieved with your solution. Not whether it’s a valid solution, as I believe that it most obviously is. Great work on that.

Sorry to bother you on this again, but I wanted to share an observation regarding your Z32 solve (which I believe is correct) which I didn’t see mentioned in your site’s breakdowns or in our previous discussion in this thread.

The Z symbol that gives the 246 degree location of the bomb also says “= 13″. 13 centimeters is approximately 5”. Looking at the placement of it in relation to the symbol, this could be a clew as to the radius to use on the map. So this one diagram says both how far to go from Mt. Diablo and in which direction. The placement of the “**O**” inside the circle could also be seen to indicate that the bomb’s location is just shy of the 13 centimeters.

I would consider this a little more compelling than when you justified using five inches with “…and then 5 inches (using the scale) is the only possible answer in inches that lands inside San Francisco. “. Maybe others would as well.

Thanks for your time.

That is a good thought. I had previously calculated that the Zodiac’s estimate was 4.84 inches (slightly shy of 5 inches), which is in fact 12.29 cm. So the black circle just shy of the circle circumference is an interesting observation. Was he therefore just lucky his selection of Ingleside Police Station just happened to marry up with his accruing victim count? Always worth delving further CZ85. By the way, the code solution wasn’t my idea – Druzer deserves all the credit for that one.

https://www.zodiacciphers.com/

“I simply cannot accept that there are, on every story, two equal and logical sides to an argument.” Edward R. Murrow.

It could be the =13 being a clew to the distance is my imagination. But he *did* add one more to his count from the 12 claimed in his prior tally. And using whole numbers, 5 inches rounds up from 12.7 to 13 centimeters.

Might just be a coincidence the math works out. Or perhaps for Z it was good fortune that when he went to use the “**0**” to mark the spot on his crosshair symbol to indicate direction, he then realized that he could use 13 centimeters (the other unit of measurement on everyone’s ruler) to approximate the 5 inches of distance, since he’d so far only claimed 12. Only one victim was a rather modest bump compared to his other claims, and he couldn’t very well decrease his count to 5.

Anyway, it fits in quite nicely with the solution and gives significance to the entirety of that particular crosshair symbol. Which I feel bolsters the claim that it was included as 2nd, more subtle hint in the letter.

It also occurred to me that the z32, being referred to as a code and not a cipher, might have more to it than the letters to numbers method that produced the “234” that gives us the degrees (plus mag. North of course). That’s the direction, but where’s the distance?

Besides assigning numbers based on the order of letters in the alphabet, the other most common thing I see in tinkering with this stuff is adding the digits together in order to produce a single digit number. Well, 32 characters = 3+2. There’s the 5 that gives you the distance. So the *code* plus map gives you the location. Once again, no need to solve the cipher and no need to just assume 5 inches based on it being the whole number that puts you in S.F..

Now instead of a code with only direction, and a map (i.e. crosshair symbol) with only direction, we can now extract the distance from each of them and wind up in roughly the same place. ?

@cz85 The number theory I calculated may not be intentional because number games are so malleable. I thought it was an interesting addition but nothing more. The way I sum it all up CZ85, is the Little List gave us the SFPD, black circle, radians and inches. Even without the black circle only one possible answer exists in San Francisco – 4 radians & 5 inches. No other whole number measurement of each lands within the land mass of San Francisco. Therefore, if we are dealing in whole numbers, no other answer is possible concerning radians & inches. I just let other people keep searching for their answers, but for me, I’ve effectively closed the book on the 32 character code. You are correct; in the July 31st 1969 and November 8th 1969 communications he refers to his offerings as ciphers, yet in the June 26th 1970 and July 26th 1970 communications he on both occasions refers to the Z32 as a code – which makes sense bearing in mind the use of 29 unique characters – practically unsolvable using standard cryptographic methods of the kind employed in the solving of the Z340 and Z408. It’s pretty evident a different approach is required. I tried the A=1, B=2 method successfully, but I still fall short of claiming that part of the answer unequivocal.

https://www.zodiacciphers.com/

“I simply cannot accept that there are, on every story, two equal and logical sides to an argument.” Edward R. Murrow.

Sounds good. I’ve just never been satisfied with the assumption that the location must be in S.F. and that the number of inches must be a whole number.

Considering I’ve seen no real support for this solution outside of your own board, I figure tying in more elements would heighten its credibility. It’s easier to dismiss the notion of the Z32 as “code”, and the crosshair symbol as a crude map, when we’ve only got a (possible) direction and no distance, when both are needed. Being able to pull the (possible) distance from those two things is objectively better than leaving it solely up to inference.

Thanks again for your time and keep up the great work.

Myself and another gent on Tom’s site were looking at your Z32 solution and can’t recreate the 4.84″ distance on the Phillips map. Do you calculate that using the map Z sent or did you rely on Google maps?

Thanks for time.

@cz85 The Phillips map states that there are 6.4 miles to the inch (ignore the scale bar). 4.838 inches X 6.4 = 30.96 miles. It is exactly 30.96 miles from Mount Diablo to Ingleside PD using Google Maps, which is astonishingly accurate. You don’t need the Phillips 66 Map to calculate the inches or angle. This could be done in 1970 using longitude and latitude. But I used Google maps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=982aVPvCv7I&ab_channel=jakeguitar01

https://www.zodiacciphers.com/

“I simply cannot accept that there are, on every story, two equal and logical sides to an argument.” Edward R. Murrow.

Thanks! Fyi, here’s what the other fellow calculates as 5″ and 251 degrees using the actual Phillips map. When I challenged him on the 17cm he said “My app, of course, is using cm *relative to the image on my screen* or, more precisely, to the scale of the *virtual* image on the page.”

I then pulled up a picture of the map laid out next to a ruler and it did indeed appear that 5″ from Diablo puts you in the ocean.

Maybe he and I are doing something wrong, but if not then I figured you should know of this discrepancy.

@cz85 How do you know the dimensions of the map you pulled up is to scale. 30.96 miles is the exact measurement using Google maps from Diablo to Ingleside PD.

Shaq stated “And *five* inches – which is what Grinell claims to have from his cipher ‘solve’ – is equal to 5 x 6.4 = 32 miles, which is “astonishingly *in*-accurate” according to his proposed method. Jeez Louise”.

That is why the code has “estimate” before it. Zodiac rounded off 4.84 inches and 4.08 radians to give us a simplistic solution to the code using whole numbers. I have already explained in multiple articles about the 32 miles being the exact measurement of 5 X 6.4, but the idea is that Zodiac gave us an estimate to keep the code simple. Otherwise the code would have read “four point o eight radians and four point eight four inches. In fact the exact measurement of either radians or inches could go to endles decimal points if you don’t want me to even round it off to 4.84. But I doubt Zodiac would have created a never ending code. He had to round it off. The April 20th letter gave us the diagram, spoke of the attack on Park Police Station and stated it wouldn’t do to move into somebody elses territory (coupled with the SFPD attribution on the Little List crosshairs). Also 30.96 miles is 97% accurate, which again, I have already explained in the article.

Shaq & co have a different take that I don’t agree with, and never the twain shall meet. That is fine.

https://www.zodiacciphers.com/

I totally agree that totally precise measurements would be unexpected. And I agree that 6.4 miles is supposed to equal 32 miles on the Phillips map.

As for the scale, and digging into it further, maybe there’s something wonky with the black bar in the lower right of the map. Shaq and I have been proceeding as if that was in fact 1″ long. However pulling up this picture, with a ruler below the map, it would seem the bar is longer than 1″. It doesn’t say it’s an inch that I can see, and it’s broken up into five sections. Confusing! Any idea what those increments are and how to get scale off a picture of Z’s map? lol.

Sorry for the aggravation Richard. I’m actively trying to promote your solution, if that helps. ?

I looked at that scale years ago and it doesn’t appear accurate when measured against a known 6.4 mile distance on the map. I will have another look.

https://www.zodiacciphers.com/

Image blown up.

https://www.zodiacciphers.com/

Thanks. I’m wondering if it’s representing distances in miles/km rather than inches. Like this.

That would make far more sense, but I just can’t find a picture where the increments are visible. It would certainly explain the large discrepancy between it and Google.