I cannot speak for the bullets, but I believe that Morf indicated somewhere that an officer at the scene furtively took one of the shell casings home with him as a "souvenir".

I find this suspicious.

Mike Rodelli suggested that Russell Butterbach may have taken a casing home. If this were the case (although cannot be verified) it would be one of the most ridiculous things I’ve ever heard.

viewtopic.php?f=93&t=4306&p=69650&hilit=Butterbach+shell#p69650

Morf confirms it here.

Ten shots were fired that night –

Where do you get 10 shots fired? The initial report shows only 9 shell cases recovered? Not trying to argue, I honestly don’t know.

The police sketches detail 10 casings = 10 bullets – and one particular police report details all the casing distances (of which there were 9), with one casing being found on the front passenger floorboard. Notice the exhibits detail 9 cartridge cases found at scene. These I suspect were the 9 found on the turnout floor, with the casing on the floorboard of the Rambler likely towed away with the vehicle and "misplaced".

http://www.zodiackiller.com/LHRPR6.html

Hence the missing casing.

Was it ever established if the security guard who was seen talking to a driver of car shortly before the attack ever interviewed ?

I have never heard that he was. I’ve often wondered if it was James Owens.

I don’t think it could have been as he didn’t leave his home until 10.55.

Agree that the position of BLJ’s body is strange.

If a person is running away from a guy with a gun, this person would most likely lean forward (while running fast). Thus, also fall into that direction. We won’t discuss this as it is a physical law (inertia of masses in movement. However, before dying a human body is truly not just a ‘mass’.

Let’s compare it with a runner collapsing:

Chris Legh, indeed fell on his back (but he was not ‘running’ anymore)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyYkKkLRAec

Interesting also this guy (1:15 min.):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSZlSaPJAdQ

After collapsing, he tried to stand up and because of that, he fell backwards again.

The mass of a running body, however, continues to go forward with quite a lot of power. It does, of course, even after the legs or other significant muscles had given up their tension, which is the actual reason for the body to fall on the ground.

See minute 3:15 and 4:20 to get hopefully convinced that this physical law indeed works pretty well:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcMVQUOuX5w

Not yet? Here the same (at 5:05 min.):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcMVQUOuX5w

All running (!) bodies in such situation fall into their moving direction. It’s a physical law.

According to this, we may rule out the scenario that BLJ had been shot while running away from the Rambler.

Imagine you get shot – few things will actually happen:

a.) Blood. The wound is open, blood is getting out of your body. Only after approximately one liter has left your body, you might get unconscious and fall to the ground. If possible, you most likely would walk around befort that happens, seeking help etc.

b.) Pain. Everybody of us has at least once accidentially cut our finger with a knife, causing a somatic pain immediately driving to the brain. Inner organs, however, are not like our skin. Such visceral pain is not only slower but is our brain not even able to locate the exact region where the pain comes from. An entry wound of ‘only’ .22 caliber in diameter is actually pretty small. Even five of such entry wounds would probably not cause an extreme pain, as we might think.

c.) Shock. You either run or can’t even move anymore. Possibly no pain is felt at all or just as a warm, numb feeling.

d.) Dysfunction. Most of our body parts don’t appreciate a .22 caliber bullet going through them. While a liver, muscle etc. would still work somehow (at least partially), an enty wound to the lung would lead to an immediate collapse of at least one side of it, causing pretty much pain as well as shortage of breath.

e.) Confusion. A person who is getting shot is probably not realising everything quickly (talking about the logical part, not the cognitive /adrenaline one). People rather react on seeing a gun rather than getting their wound (except feeling pain). There indeed exist reports about people who got shot and realize it even hours or a full day after the incident.

To analyze BLJ’s body position, it should be considered:

1. Her body implies a falling towards, not away from the Rambler. At least as long she had not made some handstand.

2. BLJ was lying on her stomach, with her left leg slightly bent, both shoes still on her feet.

3. Her arms were close to her body rather than spread away from the body; also rather not implying fast running.

4. All bullets went into the right side of her torso. At least two bullets nearly missed her (approx. 2 inches), the other three were quite centrally.

5. Her body was lying pretty far away from the cartridge cases.

If we go a bit deeper into the ballistic report as well as the crime scene drawings, we realize that one shot had been fired from approx. 20 feet away – which possibly was the one into the Rambler.

A second cartridge/bullet is also pretty easy to get an idea about, it is the one that hit David Faraday. The bullet was found inside his head, one of the cartridge cases amongst others on the floor nearby.

All other cartridge cases were found in that area, except one lying inside the car, implying that Z was standing next to the car when he had fired his other eight shots.

Regarding the bullets:
– one bullet was found inside Faradays head
– two bullets were found inside Jensen’s body
– one bullet was found inside the Rambler
– one bullet was found in Jensen’s dress (exit wound)
– one bullet was found in Jensen’s panties (exit wound)
– one bullet was found on the ground near Jensen’s body (exit wound)

Latter implies that at least one shot of the five hitting Jensen had been fired from some reasonable distance. Two shots, however, missed Jensen’s body completely. Thus, Z is not such a nice marksman as he claimed to be. One or two shots almost missed Jensen’s body for about two inches.

My conclusion:

BLJ did not run. She might have fallen backwards, still moving in pain onto her stomach, but she did not run. She was too weak to run already.

Except one or two warning shots, all bullets were fired from near the Rambler.

We know that David had put his hands on the steering wheel earlier. BLJ was on the passanger seat, where she had been seen before, too. Now let David stand next to the Rambler, either asking her to take his ring or having put his hands on the Rambler’s roof as being ordered to do by Z (police method?). David gets a shot, leading to an immediate dysfunction of his body.

BLJ now, of course, freaks out and starts moving away from the assailant. This is towards the other side of the car (driver seat). While this happens, Z finds his time to go forward, possibly even disturbed by the falling body of David, and shoot BLJ while she still was inside the Rambler. He hit her into the back as whe had already turned around, away from him. Z only hits her on the right side, however, because of the seat, the B-pillar of the car as well as him arriving from the left of the passenger entrance. Faraday was said to be found near the back tire wheel, was shot from the left. Therefore, Z had to move forward to get towards the passenger door, giving BLJ time to already move. No matter if the driver door was open or not, BLJ did not make it outside the car in time. After opening the passenger door or shooting through an open window, Z had already started to shoot BLJ – her still being inside the Rambler.

This enabled Z to place at least three shots into the back of BLJ. However, most of them into the right side of her torso, which from his point of view was the first part visible of his victim when coming from the rear of the Rambler. Still able to get out of the car BLJ opens the driver door, if not left open by David, and exits the car on the driver’s side. She possibly hurts her right knee on the floor, injuring her skin.

She then is either ‘ordered’ back or seeks the easiest way out, which is running to the left (to the right is the door). She might have had looked on David’s body before she turned away again, explaining her to not having run down the street. Possibly, some fence and trees (protection) where the first location she had tried to get to.

Weakened, shocked, confused, already having received about three shots inside the car, BLJ finally walkes away from the Rambler. Z shoots her additionally, from a distance, knowing that he had not to follow her. He places four more shots, enjoying the ‘hunt’ but missing her at least once or twice. He finally hits her, explaining the additional bullet which had not been ‘carried’ by BLJ’s textile but was found on the ground. These shots, however, were not central on her torso anymore.

The ‘secret’ how Z had been able to place five shots into the back of BLJ is that the shooting happened in two parts. One while BLJ was inside the car, making her an easy victim. The second, two shots out of four hitting her somewhere.

This scenario also explains the one shell casing inside the car, on the passenger side (flipped out to the right with Z firing while likely even reaching into the car).

Seconds after BLJ had exited the Rambler, the bleeding had started as well. First, her textiles soak her blood. With problems even to breath, still in shock, her body collapses on the spot where she died later. Falling into some unconciousness which, due to the loss of blood / dysfunction of her organs, had led to her death. All blood rinsing out from her remains on the ground where she had died, with no blood at all inside the Rambler.

No matter how BLJ actually had fallen to the ground, this scenario explains some things:

– David was shot first
– Pattern / shooting ‘skills’ of Z
– Casing inside the car, on the passenger side
– Open drivers’ side car door

QT

Ballistic report
https://www.zodiacciphers.com/zodiac-ne … ics-report

Crime scene pictures
ATTENTION – graphic/disturbing pictures…some may only want to see the first, the second is hard to watch, even for tough minds:
https://www.insearchofthezodiackiller.com/431564205 )

Regarding the bullets:
– one bullet was found inside Faradays head
– two bullets were found inside Jensen’s body
– one bullet was found inside the Rambler
– one bullet was found in Jensen’s dress (exit wound)
– one bullet was found in Jensen’s panties (exit wound)
– one bullet was found on the ground near Jensen’s body (exit wound)

This doesn’t tally with either the police report or DOJ report. Neither mention a bullet found in Jensen’s dress.
There was also a bullet recovered from the left rear wheel well (left storage area). In total, 2 bullets embedded in the Rambler. I certainly agree with most of your statements, but it is a very difficult crime to pin down the exact order of events.

https://www.zodiacciphers.com/

“I simply cannot accept that there are, on every story, two equal and logical sides to an argument.” Edward R. Murrow.

 

One thing I’d like to add Quicktrader – remember James Owen stating there was nobody in and around the vehicles when he passed the crime scene. We assume that he didn’t observe any of the vehicles car doors open. It has been suggested that the Zodiac Killer may have hidden the couple out of sight as Owen passed – and once he did – he began the attack about 30 seconds later. If so, why was the Rambler car door now open. This observation by Owen has never been satisfactorily explained.

One thing I’d like to add Quicktrader – remember James Owen stating there was nobody in and around the vehicles when he passed the crime scene. We assume that he didn’t observe any of the vehicles car doors open. It has been suggested that the Zodiac Killer may have hidden the couple out of sight as Owen passed – and once he did – he began the attack about 30 seconds later. If so, why was the Rambler car door now open. This observation by Owen has never been satisfactorily explained.

That is a horrific scenario to imagine.

Also, I’d like to ask a really important question. When Zodiac pulled up alongside the Rambler, do you believe he began the attack immediately by firing into the Rambler – and how long in seconds or minutes do you believe it was between parking alongside the Rambler and killing his first victim? There is good reason for the question.

Just a guess but Z might have backed his car in, parallel to the Rambler.

The first (warning) shot could also have been a final shot, to simply finish his magazine or messing up with the crime scene. Not sure about that. Owen had only heard one single shot. But in that case, he had not seen Jensen’s body, which normally would have been the case.

Still wondering why the couple did not run/drive away after hearing the first shot. This might imply that Faraday, the driver, had gotten the first shot. The rest of the scenario works pretty well, with BLJ fleeing.

By backing his car into the lot (if so), Z was able to get away faster after committing the crime. It also explains, why he did not accidentially drive over the body of Jensen.

When parking next to them, he got certainly got the attention of Jensen and Faraday. After exiting his car, there was not very much time for talking. He most likely started with the shooting quickly after that. He did not waste too much time at Blue Rock Springs either.

Z might have had talked to Faraday somehow. Otherwise Faraday would not have had exited his car towards a gunman, nor would there have been such a point-blank situation. It is possible that Faraday was outside the car, talking to Z, when Z had pulled out his gun.

Parking his car: 15 seconds
Getting out of his car: 5 seconds
Mentally preparing, pulling gun: 5 seconds
Warning shot: 3 seconds
Walking to the Rambler, ordering David to get out of the car, threatening to shoot Jensen: 15 seconds
Faraday getting out of the car, walking around: 15 seconds
Z pushing him around, holding his gun to the head, talking some nonsense: 25 seconds
Shooting Faraday: 2 seconds
Walking towards front of the car, opening the door: 3 seconds
Shooting Jensen the first time: 5 seconds
Ordering her back: 5 seconds
Shooting her again from some distance: 5 seconds
Walking back to his car, start motor: 10 seconds
Driving out, around the body of Jensen (he did not back up then, driving over her): 5 seconds
Rushing away.

Overall, a maximum of 1:58 minutes would be enough to commit this crime. To do everything in less than a minute might be complicated, but still possible. Most likely it took between 2-3 minutes, probably no more than 5 minutes.

The statement of Owen, that he did not see anybody inside the car, is irritating. It might be explained that he was not able to see the body of Faraday at all and, in addition to that, had overseen the body of Jensen. Somewhat unlikely but with her being down is not more to see than a 5 inch high, pink spot. He could have been frightened, not telling the (full) truth to the police, too.

Or he just did not see the body of Jensen.

I always wondered why Faraday stood that close to the car, with his back not towards the car but the other direction. There is two possibilities for that, imo. The first one is that Faraday had just followed the instructions of Z, under gunpoint. The second one is more exciting: What if Z made Faraday to put his hands onto the vehicle? As if he had gotten ‘arrested’ by Z, for what reason ever?

The ring in Faradays fingers must have been staged. Rigor mortis does not start that quickly.

Assume Z backing in, exiting the car, talking to the young couple, possibly even showing some real or fake police ID. Faraday gets out of the car. Z asks him to put his hands on the vehicle, gets into some kind of rage. Puts his gun onto Faradays head, kills him. Quickly goes for the girl, shooting her while exiting, ordering her back even, shooting her again. But then the car from Owen drives by. Z ducks behind the Rambler. And is lucky, Owen did not see the body. After waiting a few seconds, Z finally sends a shot into the Rambler. Most likely to hide that he had shot the girl inside the car. But he forgets about the casing on the floor. And the pattern on her back. By shooting the Rambler afterwards, Z got later able to bragg with his marksmanship.

Pretty sure that from this perspective, at night, it is possible that Owen had indeed not seen the body of Jensen.

QT

I ask it for a good reason Quicktrader. When James Owen travelled from Vallejo along LHR he has at least one stretch of road devoid of bends and dips, and is able to see at least 40 seconds in front of him, but reports no taillights or vehicle ahead of him. When he is just short of the turnout he has a visual on the turnout at least 30 seconds before reaching it. He doesn’t mention any headlights approaching from the Benicia end and entering the turnout. Therefore, at a bare minimum, when he spotted the two vehicles as he drove alongside the turnout, the Zodiac Killer’s vehicle must have been present in the turnout for at least 30 seconds (it could have been there much longer) – but he sees no people in or around either vehicle. He heard no shots, saw no victims on the turnout floor, no doors open and no shattered glass. If this were true, then how do we reconcile the events that night.

You are right. He was just driving by..the glass would have been on the other side, Faraday would have been on the other side, the casings, Z, all on the other side, not visible for Owen. Even Jensen’s body, just a pink spot on the floor, moreless behind the Rambler, at least from his perspective. Maximum 10 inches high, with Betty’s dark hair even covering most of her body towards his point of view.

Owen has looked somewhere else: Another car, behind the Rambler, too. Obvious that he was not able to describe the model or the color in detail. But it shows where his eyes had been in that second. Not too much time to watch when driving by the scene.

It’s all a theory rather than ‘facts’, I know, but it’s the only way I can explain the bullet pattern on Jensen’s back..earlier I had thought that Z had shot her while lying on the floor, but the bullet story doesn’t fit such story.

I guess it might even still be possible to find one of the bullets that had exited BLJ body on the other side of the street (metal detector anyone?). If it is still there and not rusted away completely.

Wouldn’t say that BLJ’s injuries were ‘minor’, but it could have been possible that she had survived. IMO the shot into the liver/kidney area was lethal. Most blood to see there, too. A pneumotorax is bad, but not lethal at all. So are shots to the shoulder or the lower back. Spleen, kidney, yes but a person could also live with one kidney only. But the blood loss from that region might be killing in minutes if not seconds. Smaller wounds do not start to bleed immediately, btw, it takes approximately 5-20 seconds. Enough for BLJ to exit her Rambler and walk a few steps.

Owen saw the rest of the crime, imo, not the beginning. Guess just a minute after Owen had passed the scene, the second car was gone. Stella Burgess arriving few minutes later, realizing the mess. If she had seen another car on the opposite lane, that certainly would have been Z, still gunpowder on his hands.

QT

Wasn’t a bullet found in Betty Lou’s panties?

I ask it for a good reason Quicktrader. When James Owen travelled from Vallejo along LHR he has at least one stretch of road devoid of bends and dips, and is able to see at least 40 seconds in front of him, but reports no taillights or vehicle ahead of him. When he is just short of the turnout he has a visual on the turnout at least 30 seconds before reaching it. He doesn’t mention any headlights approaching from the Benicia end and entering the turnout. Therefore, at a bare minimum, when he spotted the two vehicles as he drove alongside the turnout, the Zodiac Killer’s vehicle must have been present in the turnout for at least 30 seconds (it could have been there much longer) – but he sees no people in or around either vehicle. He heard no shots, saw no victims on the turnout floor, no doors open and no shattered glass. If this were true, then how do we reconcile the events that night.

I don’t think it would be unusual for a young couple making out to duck down to avoid being spotlighted by an oncoming car. Z, of course, would’ve ducked out of sight too. I can’t imagine another explanation, given the tight time frame,