I think the card connection to Z is pretty obvious, not that it was Z, could have been a phoney, but it sounded like Z, and it referenced Z.

"Sought Victim 12".."Peek through the Pines", "pass lake tahoe areas", Z Symbol, Upside Down "around in the snow", & Sierra Club. Never could figure the last 2 out, what or why they are there.

But the connection to Donna Lass isn’t there. Maybe once they investigated Donna (coming from SF recently), Nurse at Letterman, they began to make a connection to Z via that info. I would think they would have done that long before the card came out.

lots of interesting stuff on DL here recently..well recent to me..I have no idea or opinion on where DL is..suffice to say she is missing and I would hope some LEO at least is digging on this case when even a tidbit of info is learned

I think the only reason she is associated with z, is because the mystery postcard with the z clues. Even if Z did not kill her, if he was the sender of that card, he chose to make her seem as if she was his victim for some unknown reason. There were lots of murdered & missing women all over CA in those days, yet for some reason, Z or somebody pretending to be Z, mailed that card linking Lass to Z. There must have been some reason for that.

Nothing on that card links Donna.

No that’s true but I think it’s the card itself (sporting the crosshairs of Zodiac) , coupled with the fact that Donna had only recently arrived in S. L Tahoe having moved from San Francisco where she worked at Letterman Hospital, a building located on the grounds of the Predisio, the same Presidio that boasts being the place in which the last official sighting of ‘Zodiac’ is reported.

I said the other day that if, and I stress IF, Donna was and is a Zodiac ‘Victom’, then she may hold the key to unmasking him because she simply must have had some sort of relationship with him, be it professional, personal, close or general association. I suppose there will be those that will argue that the following is all coincidence:

Zodiac is active for just shy of one year in and around the Bay Area.
Donna Works at Hosp. at Presidio. Zodiac last seen in and around, maybe even heading toward, that area.
Donna decides it’s time to move from S.F to S.L Tahoe as a job offer is there waiting.
Donna Moves away from the Bay Area.
Zodiac, coincidentally, also vanishes from the Bay Area with no more confirmed attacks after Oct 11 of 69.
Donna is now settling into her new job and life in S.L Tahoe.
Zodiac, having vacated the Bay Area, also seems to have relocated to S.L Tahoe.

Then, with a new City bursting with potential ‘Victoms’ The Zodiac just happens to abduct and/or kill the one person in S.L Tahoe who, like himself, has just recently moved there from San Francisco.

Well Donna is therefore, in that scenario, the Worlds most unlucky woman. She moves away from a city where a serial Killer calling himself ‘Zodiac’ is collecting slaves for his afterlife, and relocated to the safety of South Lake Tahoe out of this mad mans Cross Hairs. But then, having lived in San Fran for the entire ten months Zodiac is active and managed to avoid becoming a victom, she moves away only to find that Zodiac has also fancied a change of scenery and Donna ends up on his little list.

Statistical probability of this happening by chance? I don’t know, but it’s probably astronomical odds against it.

I think, if Zodiac was her assailant, that he doesn’t give ‘victim 12’ a name, or location of a body, because he very likely had links to her that could be tracked back to himself.

…Then, with a new City bursting with potential ‘Victoms’ The Zodiac just happens to abduct and/or kill the one person in S.L Tahoe who, like himself, has just recently moved there from San Francisco.

Well Donna is therefore, in that scenario, the Worlds most unlucky woman. She moves away from a city where a serial Killer calling himself ‘Zodiac’ is collecting slaves for his afterlife, and relocated to the safety of South Lake Tahoe out of this mad mans Cross Hairs. But then, having lived in San Fran for the entire ten months Zodiac is active and managed to avoid becoming a victom, she moves away only to find that Zodiac has also fancied a change of scenery and Donna ends up on his little list.

Who says Zodiac moved to South Lake Tahoe? You are basing this off Larry Kane, I get that, but if Zodiac was not Larry than there is zero evidence Zodiac moved to Lake Tahoe.

Thousands and thousands of people lived in S.F. and managed to not get in the cross-hairs of Zodiac and considering two other female employees of the Sahara Tahoe were assaulted in the parking lot, chances are Donna was not the target of the Zodiac killer.

Lake Tahoe is an easy drive from San Francisco and the Bay area. Zodiac or whomever the culprit was could have simply gone to Lake Tahoe for a weekend or an overnight trip. Google the maps and you’ll see how easy it is.

Further, I think it would be very easy for a non-resident to get away with this much more easily than a resident would as Lake Tahoe is a small resort area and the regulars would probably have been looking everywhere and suspecting any and everyone because the livliehood of the town depends on the tourists and they would not want to discourage people from visiting the area.

From Lake Tahoe, the culprit could easily have left the state and gone to others and have been back to work in the San Francisco Bay area or wherever he lived bright and early Monday a.m. Then when everyone was talking about what they’d done over the weekend, he could brag about his luck at gambling or mention he’d seen a good show even if he hadn’t because all the shows playing are advertised all over just as they are in Reno and Las Vegas.

I just remembered reading somewhere something about Donna having gone flying with some men or man. I think it may have had something to do with a helicopter and possibly two men.

Now this would be an interesting angle to investigate as if the man had access to a plane (owned one?) then certainly it would have been someone she must have been fairly well acquainted with and I’d think her sister would have heard all about it.

It probably would have been someone she knew from Santa Barbara as she was young and hadn’t been working that long. So her sister again would probably be able to pinpoint or guess where she might have met such a person if she hadn’t known him from where she grew up and attended school.

Santa Barbara is a wealthy area. That’s where I’d guess she would have met someone who would take her flying and maybe those close friends and family would not have known the person’s name but might recall Donna having told them about the experience as she probably would have been very excited and thrilled with the adventure.

Hi capricorn,

Donna’s friend Joanne, the one who was to meet Donna that night, was the one who mentioned flying with a couple of guys from S.F. I spoke with her on the phone and still communicate with her.

When I asked her about this, she told me she did go flying a couple of times, but could not remember Donna having ever gone and did not remember any association to Riverside–as I believe it was Graysmith who mentioned that.

That’s not to say Donna may have known someone else who flew. It’s just that the story originated with her friend and Graysmith.

Thanks for the information! You are good!

I’ve been thinking more about this since I posted, trying to put myself in her shoes as I can easily relate, being that I could easily have become a victim myself, as could so many others.

The next time you talk to your friend, maybe you could ask her if Donna was the type that would have told her about meeting new people, especially if it was a man asking her out on a date? You’ve probably already discussed everything you can think of in detail but it is amazing how sometimes the strangest things can trigger memories. I find myself being able to recall conversations almost verbatim about certain things with certain people that took place when I was a child but then I’m a Capricorn!

Most girlfriends would share things like this imo. in the course of conversations among other topics such as work, moving to a new apt. or area, getting a car, etc. especially when you’re both single and just starting out!

It sounds like they were close friends since this girl had driven to Lake Tahoe to spend the weekend with Donna. OTOH, Donna was pretty busy, I’m sure and may have been the type of person that didn’t like to talk much on the telephone, for instance, and would save her "news" to share with friends until they were together in person.

I just think that if there was any prior association between the abductor and Donna, that someone might remember something now years later (especially in view of all that is now known about the other victims and Zodiac) that they never connected at the time. They might think of something that Donna mentioned as they were driving somewhere and didn’t think much of it at the time as they were concentrating on traffic but something might just trigger a memory about something that may seem trivial but could be a clue.

Otherwise, I’d tend to think the abductor was a complete stranger or an employee of the hotel. It does appear from her handwritten notes that something bad happened like someone putting a handkerchief with chloroform over her mouth to subdue her enough to get her out without anyone hearing or noticing. She could also have been injected with something that would do this!

Do you know for sure if Donna went home? Was her car at her residence?

I’m also curious to know if the friend or Donna’s sister knew more about the kind of nursing Donna did. All I recall is she did private duty for an elderly doctor. If she did any other kind, then it would be interesting to know the details on that as she could have met the abducter through her work as has been suggested by others IIRC.

Sorry to be so long and I know I’ve asked before but wonder if maybe this friend knew if the nurses’ office had a medication cabinet with any prescription type drugs in it?

To summarize….there are only two possibilities re. the abducter. It had to be someone who knew Donna in some way or it was a complete stranger. IMO if it was a strange maniac, it would seem rather unlikely that he’d know where the nurse’s office was and then figure out how to get in there and get her out unless he was just after a nurse and in some crazed way of thinking decided he was going to get one from a hotel.

Or this is probably really far fetched and the friend mightn’t have a clue but wondering if perhaps Donna went somewhere in the hotel on her breaks and could have met stranger turned abducter at the hotel earlier in the evening. This makes me think of the other victims and there association with restaurants. If say Zodiac was there in a coffee shop, restaurant, lounge area or whatever the hotel offered to the public at the time and Donna just happened to go in for a lunch break, I could see how easily he could have spotted her and easily "picked up" on her by engaging her in some seemingly innocent, friendly conversation. Even if he didn’t appear to be flirting and she was wearing her nurse’s uniform, he could have approached her and just asked a basic question about something like what time it was or lied and asked where the nurse’s office was saying he was with someone who had a condition that might need checking on so he wanted to know just in case it was necessary to consult her. (Wolf in sheep’s clothing approach!)
Then if the abducter knew her in some way, the question becomes how and why.

I wonder if JoAnne spoke with the guys she went flying with after Donna went missing and if so, what their reaction was? How did JoAnne know these men? Where did she meet them? Could Donna have met them at a later date and gone with them unbeknownst to JoAnne? Was JoAnne also a nurse?

Does JoAnne remember if these guys owned the plane or did they just rent one or was it a tourist-type ride? Would she remember the kind of work these guys did or company they worked for? Is she still in touch with them?

I think this is interesting as I’m thinking there’s a good chance JoAnne met these guys at some sort of singles’ affair if she hadn’t personally known them through family, school, work, etc. If that is the case, it is possible perhaps that Donna might have gone to the same affair or spot without JoAnn and metup with the same guys or others. It could have been somewhere where pilots socialized or people took flying lessons.

I remember in those days there was a group called "The Alumni Club" that sponsored huge dances at venues such as the Ambassador Hotel in Los Angeles (where Sen. Robert Kennedy was assassinated) and singles would go there to dance and meet other singles. I don’t know if they still exist but think they may have had dances in places throughout California and maybe even the USA. If it was throughout California, I’m pretty sure they would have had some in places like Santa Barbara and San Francisco. U of Santa Barbara is affiliated with the California University System just as UC Berkely is.

Another possible connection comes to mind re. where singles would go in those days as I remember going to one myself with a girlfriend and that was at a naval base IIRC near San Pedro. She had found out about it and we decided to go check it out. As I can remember, it was very nice and at something like the Officer’s Club. It was similar to a yacht club setting and there was a lounge area and the Naval Officers were dressed nicely in white uniforms but casually. I don’t recall there being any dancing and not sure about music but tables and just meeting some very nice men who were very polished and very much the gentlemen! We were very conservative, much like it sounds Donna was so that is why I’m thinking she could have met someone someplace like this even if she only ventured out occasionally.

Also in those days, the aerospace industry was a major employer and there were lots of young professional engineer types with PHD’S who were single and would frequent these dances sponsored by the Alumni Club and similar associations where college grads would go. Many of these men seemed attracted to sports cars and sailboats and I’m sure Lear jets as well. Donna easily could have gone to one of these functions alone, met someone and given them her phone number and never even mentioned it to anyone close especially if the guy never called. If it was Zodiac, he could have just kept the number and then somehow started following her and she wouldn’t have necessarily known.

I’ll try and answer briefly what I know as I think a lot of what you ask is already posted.

Donna was to meet her friend at the casino when Donna got off work. Donna told her friend to meet her at the tables (Blackjack if I’m not mistaken–going off memory. Would have to go back and look at the notes I took when we were speaking). Joanne had never been there before and they thought it best to just meet at the Sahara. Donna left her car at home, most likely because Joanne would be driving her car. Donna’s apartment light was left on, probably since it is so dark when she gets home. On a side note–her friend told me Donna was afraid of the dark. When they lived together, Donna chose the garage bedroom area to live in and she thought that odd since Donna was afraid of the dark. THAT is one of those things she remembered…just sort of popped into her head.

Her friend was also a nurse. They lived together and worked together at Letterman Hospital. No strange happenings there. She didn’t remember any relationships Donna had…they were just busy working.

Joanne could not remember how she met the men who took her flying, but she remember she enjoyed it and considered getting her pilots license she enjoyed it so much. I seem to recall it was only a couple of times and she didn’t remember Donna going.

Joanne is a very nice lady. I was very grateful she was willing to speak with me.

Thanks so much, Tahoe. I’m sure Joann is nice and maybe she’ll think of something else. I am amazed at little details like that about things that happened around that time.

You have a good memory. Since I asked those questions earlier, I went back and re-read all the threads here about Donna! Her car was left at her apt. like you say. The business about these blond men is interesting and confusing.

I’d be interested to know a little more about Donna’s job in Minneapolis where she worked after graduating from nursing school and anything re. her friends and associates. Also, how did she come to California? Did she fly or drive?

I can just relate so much to her and Cheri Jo. I had a couple of friends who were R.N.’S and my sister was one and
they all went to a three-year diploma nursing school as Donna did. We were all about the same age and single and just starting out like Donna was. It was not at all unusual to find ourselves chatting with some of the most amazing people wherever we went, it seemed! I can imagine Donna and Joann would have had the same experiences and there are just so many ways Donna could have encountered the abductor without thinking a thing at all about it. She could have just met him casually at a blackjack table and not even exchanged a word and then been followed probably discreetly at a distance so no one would have noticed any odd behavior. Too bad Judith from chat can’t recall what time it was when she saw Donna talking with the photographer from the lab or maybe she did but don’t think it was mentioned.

I was also reading about the possible connection between her case and the nurse in Sacramento, Judith Hakari.

Tahoe said:

"Who says Zodiac moved to South Lake Tahoe? You are basing this off Larry Kane, I get that."

See now that really annoys me that kind of assumption. Assuming I only believe Zodiac was in the Lake Tahoe area to further an agenda, one in which I claim Kane is Zodiac and that is just absolutely wrong. Hand on heart, I didn’t even think about Kane, or any specific person or suspect for that matter, when stating what I stated. I have said many times I have issue with people who decide, based on nothing, that Theory A is correct because it fits nicely with an agenda they are pushing.

The basis for my saying Donna moves to Tahoe, Zodiac also seems to leave S.F for Tahoe is absolutely nothing to do with Lawrence Kane what so ever and everything to do with the fact that no other murder are committed by, or can be attributed to, Zodiac after Oct of 69 in and around the Bay Area, and he seems to vanish from there (at least as an active ‘death machine’ anyway.) Donna, at around this same time period moved to lake Tahoe and promptly disappears. Then, a postcard is sent with claims that victim 12 has been sought just past Lake Tahoe Area, somewhere around in the snow, just peek through the pines. This card is signed not with a name, but the Cross-Hairs (In blue felt pen aswel if memory serves me) which is, at that time, the trademark logo of The San Francisco Zodiac Killer. That’s why I say both Donna and Zodiac left San Fran for South Lake Tahoe, because he, or someone using his ‘I.D’ said that’s where he was or at least had been and hints that he’s collected a 12th slave for Paradice down there. Kane, as I said, I hadn’t even thought of when saying it.

I certainly don’t mean to put words in your mouth, but you wrote:

…Then, with a new City bursting with potential ‘Victoms’ The Zodiac just happens to abduct and/or kill the one person in S.L Tahoe who, like himself, has just recently moved there from San Francisco.

You might not have meant to imply Kane, but then why are you assuming Zodiac recently "moved" to Lake Tahoe? I mean, who else has been mentioned in regards to following Donna from S.F. and working in the same building? Maybe it’s in your subconscious.

There was also plenty of Zodiac mail sent from the Bay Area in the 70’s. If it was Zodiac who dropped off the Pines card at the Chronicle (almost 7 months later), could it be a safe bet he was just visiting Tahoe? That particular ad used for the Pines card was in the S.F. Chronicle. The one in the Reno/Tahoe area paper was a bit different.

I think it’s safe to say whoever delivered that card was hanging around S.F. and probably lived in the Bay Area.

My apologies for any assumptions in regards to you and Kane.

The many places Donna could be, is equal to the many scenarios that could have led to her abduction. It’s endless. I like Kane as Z, I like Kane as Donna’s abductor, what do I think the odds are that it was Kane, highly unlikely. There were many other nuts out there, so Kane, or Zodiac, would be 1 in a thousand. Except for the communications that took place after Donna’s disappearance, that may level the odds towards Z. Did Donna’s abductor live in S. Lake Tahoe, or anywhere in the Sierras? Might have, what’s the odds, the odds would be greatly against it, because there’s so many other places the abductor could have lived. Could the abductor carry out what we know and not live in the Tahoe Area, of course.

Wherever she is, I can’t see her being found after all this time. Even if a skull were discovered and it was hers, how long do dental records stay on file in a system in order to identify her by such means? DNA could be extracted sure, but is any of Donna family convicted felons with DNA in the Database? If not, DNA is useless without a source to compare with and match to.

And Bayarea60’s, I totally agree, when it come’s to possibilities of where Donna is and where do we focus a search, the answer is "Planet Earth."