Zodiac hails Stine and gives his destination as W’ton & M’le for a reason… he is planning on heading into a property close by so he can watch and scene unfold after the discovery of the cab. He may have saw a familiar face while he got near Maple and asked Paul to go on an extra block. This then would mean that if Zodiac had always wanted and intended to dash off onto W. Pacific Av. for its cover advantage, then he had a entrance rite at the top of Cherry to use. He ignores that and the presidio and instead seems to take a far bigges unnecessary risk by staying on the street. Zodiac wasn’t stupidly taking such a risk because he was a bit wet behind the ears, he may very well have stayed on the street path because he was heading straight for a home close by. This would be entirely consistent with the eight year old witness seeing someone that night and saying he knew the man and gave his name. I’m wondering now if this eight year old was in or near 3712 Jackson, the house that Fouke claims Zodiac was last seen heading toward. Maybe the kid saw flashing red and blue’s outside as Don Fouke slowly rolled past and he went to see what was going on outside his house and upon looking out of his window, saw ‘Zodiac face to face walking toward him and knew him from so and so 7 doors down for example? I mean I have said for a long time, with many objections by other, that ZOidac threat that ‘School Children make nice targets’ is not a general threat at all, it’s a specific threat to that child’s life and why, well because we know that the kid gave LE a name, and if LE had been to speak to this man, and it was Zodiac, the kid named in relation to the Stine murder, then the Zodiac would know instantly who had gave his name to the Law because he and the child had stared at each other face to face. If the threat aimed at school children is direct threat to this young 8 year old, then it’s almost certain whoever that kid saw and named, is Zodiac. Again I was recently tryingmy best to work out exactly why it was that Zodiac, knowing that he been seen by police, would even write and say that "Zodiac" was actually the culprite when nobody would have have ever suspected or known it was anything to do with Zodiac if he’d keptnhis mouth shut and said nothing. But not 48 hours pass and he’s now lt the police know that the face they saw that night wasn’t just any face, but that it was the face of Zodiac. Why would he do such a stupid thing for no reason? Well, he (Z) knew fully well that he and this Eight year old had seen each other eye to eye that night on the 11th and knew exactly who the child was and knew exactly that the child knew him by sight and name. So, Zodiac knew that he would be doing a fairly silly thing by telling Law Enforcement that the face they saw was a not any old random one, that was actually Zodiac. He knows the police officers that saw him will mentally try their best to look out for him now in future. So it’s stupid. But, what would the biggest concern be, two cops who don’t know you, or an Eight year old witness who does and saw you? He needs to get a message to that kid and the only really threat he can make is via letter and whilw it may look general, it may have been specific and that’s why the letter arrived within 48 HRS.

4. The last location we can place him at was on the grounds of 3712 Jackson St.

Ah..but in the scratch/memo Fouke last reports seeing him turn north on Maple…so…?? You have pointed Fouke’s inconsistencies out a lot. Why now do you take his word for 3712 Jackson? (asking genuinely)

3712 Jackson was a youth probation employee living (Bloch).

6. FBI report states that an 8 year old child saw a man that he recognized by name on Oct 11 and reported it to police.

Where is that report? Never seen that one before…thx

QT

4. The last location we can place him at was on the grounds of 3712 Jackson St.

Ah..but in the scratch/memo Fouke last reports seeing him turn north on Maple…so…?? You have pointed Fouke’s inconsistencies out a lot. Why now do you take his word for 3712 Jackson? (asking genuinely)

"Ah..but in the scratch/memo Fouke last reports seeing him turn north on Maple…so…??"

So… What do you think he’s going to say considering the circumstances? Remember that they had just concentrated all efforts on a huge search of the grounds behind the residency of 3712 Jackson and along West Pacific. Do you think he is likely to then report that "Suspect last seen turning onto house pathway and heading toward a house". If he wrote that his superiors would probably be furious that he hadn’t said this at the time on the street. Fouke said that he didn’t originally mention this fact because he didn’t think that if that man were the killer, he didn’t really live there and was probably only turning toward the house to evade the squad car.
What makes me believe Fouke about the man turning and heading toward the house is a comment he makes in another part of the memo. ""Light colored Hair, possibly greying at rear." How would Fouke have seen the back of his head be able to make this comment? Well, if the suspect had done what Fouke later said he did, and turned and escalated the steps onto a pathway, then this would mean that as Fouke was driving rite by him, the man would have his back to Fouke. Plus it seems to make sense, the Zodiac would very likely panic when confronted with a marked patrol car just yards away and heading straight toward him and, acting on pure instinct to avoid them, turned into a driveway.
"

3712 Jackson was a youth probation employee living (Bloch).

6. FBI report states that an 8 year old child saw a man that he recognized by name on Oct 11 and reported it to police.

Where is that report? Never seen that one before…thx

QT

Hold on QT, I will get it and post it here for you now.

Here is the page that can be found in the Official Online Vault of FBI files and records….

And QT I know that Helen Bloch was one of the Youth Probation Officers. But I am not trying to suggest she was The Zodiac lol. Although I have discovered that Helen’s Brother, Paul, lived right in the area where Zodiac was picked up by Stine. His addy was 5 3rd Street, San Fran

And Tahoe, another thing I forgot to mention as to why I believe Fouke on his 3712 Jackson account is because not only would Zodiac have been nervous to see Foue approaching and simply turned away to hide his face, but he would have been covered in blood all down the front of his clothes. He would have every reason to turn his back to the cops due to the saturated blood all down his trousers, and therefor allowing Fouke to see the back of his head which he makes reference to in the Memo. It makes sense.

And do you know what Industry Helen’s husband was involved in? Textiles. That brought back to mind what Bryan Hartnell said of Z’s costume and symbol "And it had about a 4 inch crossed circle on it which looked like it had been made with some kind of machine or care and attention, it wasn’t just scrawled on with white paint, it was proportional".

All circumstantial, maybe even coincidental info but worth a mention none the less.

Tahoe…

" You have pointed Fouke’s inconsistencies out a lot. Why now do you take his word for 3712 Jackson? (asking genuinely)

Perfectly good question, and i’ll answer Below…

It is not simply because Fouke said it that I believe it as the question implies, but rather a mixture of several things. Firstly, Motive. Would Zodiac have a motive for doing what Fouke said he did and turn into a driveway? Answer: Absolutely! In fact, it was imperative for Zodiac not to allow them to see the front of his trousers when he’s is close enough to notice the fresh blood stains all down the front of them. So Zodiac had more than enough Motive to do what Fouke claims, that motive being his very freedom taken followed by, in all likelihood, his life by the State.
Secondly, Fouke’s comment of suspects hair possibly greying at the rear now makes sense because we know that now in this scenario make perfect sense because any person ascending the steps and approaching the home would be positioned with his back to the road and any passing Patrol Vehicle on it.

Tahoe I know that there are other individuals at other sites that will gladly accept something that, for example, Mageau said as truth and credible when it helps their agenda or supports their own claims and theories, and yet will dismiss him as not credible in another where his comment seems to be at odds with their theory, but I am not one of them. What difference would it make to me if Zodiac went up some steps or not? What agenda would I have to say I believe Fouke about 3712? I have no underlying cause when it comes to 3712 Jackson vs North on Maple to decide one is more likely than the other. I just simply think, given the two contrasting versions two chose from, I personally think that one makes sense logically as it’s what you may expect someone to do in those circumstances, while the other one if it were true would leave me asking why it wasn’t though suspicious when a man is observed walking away from a crime scene close by and heading intoan alcove that leads nowhere other than onto a vast amount of foliage and darkness that is exactly where you may expect someone to go if they had just committed a homicide just around the corner.
And the response to the Stine incident was instant remember, Zodiac hadn’t left the cab itself and 911 was being informed of it and Fouke said, which Pelissetti confirms, that Fouke pulled up next to Pellisetti as he was waling down Cherry and Pellisetti told him the suspect was white, at which point Fouke instantly span around is his car and went straight to the Presidio and all responding and available units also emerged on the area. This means that if Zodiac was anywhere actually in the park of wooded area, then the hunter had become the hunted and he was totally surrounded and is a sitting duck. With the manpower they had searching the park along with the equipment they used such as huge powerful search lights that would allow then extremely good visibility, and Chief Lee’s words of the area search as having beem "Tree by Tree and Bush by Bush – A mouse couldn’t have escaped our attention" I would put my money on Zodiac not being in that park. But wherever he was it had to be close for two reasons. 1. He had no time to get any distance before the police converged on and had the area cordoned. 2. He must have been some close enough to see the search because he told them where the bikes went and where the cars were parked along West Pacific and the distance between the two groups of them.

This is the commonly accepted point that Zodiac used to make his escape. Obviously this is where he would have been if he was last seen going North on Maple.

But just to give some sort of visual perspective as to the alternate, far quicker and safer entrance onto the same stretch of road (W. Pacific Avenue)?

The barrier seen directly to the left in the photo is the wall entrance from Maple street. The red arrow is the entrance area that is atop of Cherry st. If he knew this entrance was available to him why wouldn’t he take it if he was truly intending to escape by "dashing into the Presidio?"

Here is the page that can be found in the Official Online Vault of FBI files and records….

Can someone fill me in on who this person is?

Here is the page that can be found in the Official Online Vault of FBI files and records….

Can someone fill me in on who this person is?

That is what is frustrating, nobody knows who the Eightv year old was or where he saw the suspect, and we don’t know who it was he named as the Suspect.

I’ve said for a while now that we all think this case is so complicated and "Crack-Proof" and we may have had the answer staring us in the face all along if we only could discover either who the eight year old was and/or who he named. This eight year old is probably still alive today and he may hold the key to one of Americas biggest unsolved mysteries. Not saying that he does or is eve likely too, but until we know and ask we won’t know

Lots of conversations have taken place on this topic over the years….The 8 year old boy, well we just don’t know. Where was the boy, where did he see the man he knew? We know the 8 year old boy and the man he knew would have been spoken to in depth, and this man was not considered a suspect. I’d love to read the follow up on this report. What did SFPD and FBI do with it?
I think folks got off track on Z saying "Over there by Wash and Maple". I think Z knew PH. And he makes the statement in his letter to let cops know he was the same guy written about in Stine’s fare book. If he mentions he ‘s the one who killed PS at Wash and Cherry, well no duh, that’s where the cops find PS and his cab. To me he’s giving the cops a detail, that only the killer would know, and the fare Stine picked up in the Theater District.
Pellessetti is the key guy to me. From here on I’ll refer to Foukes as "F" and Pellessetti as "P". P states he was close, very close to Cherry & Wash when he received the call. I believe he was, but unlike F who states exactly where he was, we don’t know. We know that once Z turned down Cherry and began heading N. towards the park it’s about 361′ I think to Jackson. I don’t have my notes in front of me. If P was within a minute, Z could not get to Jackson before P rolls up at Wash and Cherry. P rolls up to cherry and stops his squad car in front of cab half out on cherry. I believe Z sees P roll up and if he had any intention of continuing N. on Cherry that would kill that idea.
We know F states he was on Presidio approaching Wash. when he received the call about a black guy who robbed a cabbie. At this point F is less than 1 minute from meeting up with P at Cherry and Jackson. That to me proves the call that P answered, and the call that F answered are 2 separate dispatches. There’s no way P could do all the things he did, with the kids, observing Stine, and supposedely calling in update from black guy to white guy, and from robber to killer, it P & F rec’d. the same dispatch. Just impossible I don’t believe P at all there. I don’t think he ever put in the 2nd call before heading N. on Cherry in search of killer. F would have been updated before seeing Z. F never gets another dispatch, he learns from P that there has been a murder, by a white guy. It’s F who calls in telling dispatch of his encounter, and that he saw suspect heading/turning N. onto Maple. F later states he never saw suspect at Maple, only assumed suspect was heading towards park.
In Z’s 1st letter I think it arrived on the 14th, he only reports the actions that took place in the park from someone who could hear what was going on. The cops lit that park up like a ballfield, Z never mentions that, he never mentions the dogs. for sure he would have mentioned the dogs if he were being hunted by them. He only mentions what he could hear. In another message I’ll share my experience in the park around July/Aug. 1970 with a Nam Canine Trainer and what he had to say about Z being in the park.