similar to what you are doing smokie.. this gives a high bigram count. simply odds evens columns then each column moved up one. then read top to bottom left to right.. the over all solve is not great but the first two words are DON CARDON which would be a neat way to start of your next code knowing Don Harden had solved the first one so easy.

Very interesting! Unfortunately I can not reproduce the cipher you have created. I sort odd/oven columns (which is column order period 2) and then I shift the whole cipher up by one. This results in 25 bigrams. Could you please post your cipher? Or maybe you have an idea what I am doing wrong?

this is it largo… if you need i can show it from a spreadsheet view but i will have to take a pic of it and post it cheers

16 14 32 12 30 1 10 28 22 31 8 26 33 19 10 6 24
26 23 52 25 4 22 39 45 9 4 13 2 20 19 30 50 10
28 13 17 5 36 6 17 17 15 19 53 15 33 34 43 48 55
36 27 62 34 13 31 41 5 19 6 16 46 36 51 31 11 29
40 16 47 7 24 23 51 43 14 20 9 27 13 3 54 44 31
49 3 23 5 19 44 7 25 21 19 53 21 50 41 19 41 27
37 21 19 5 23 15 5 19 16 11 15 19 19 11 14 20 53
55 3 21 38 8 51 51 40 47 29 38 48 30 50 36 39 15
1 19 37 44 11 56 8 60 31 40 54 41 18 61 8 37 33
18 35 7 49 30 59 40 63 55 19 6 22 16 2 28 20 33
20 5 40 23 38 18 34 20 23 29 42 32 47 5 6 54 56
42 37 51 58 19 20 29 37 51 63 18 35 21 19 1 30 58
46 3 57 22 16 5 61 52 3 15 12 20 56 23 23 11 5
19 32 39 19 20 28 58 19 20 45 12 36 46 44 22 16 61
7 25 53 36 48 19 36 19 40 48 39 21 37 8 2 50 51
8 50 16 36 26 29 42 17 6 50 11 11 28 38 57 13 19
17 5 55 3 3 19 53 4 32 11 5 51 1 38 36 34 50
56 7 26 21 36 37 16 47 7 53 23 51 14 55 19 40 51
30 31 29 42 20 31 6 59 40 63 9 27 62 34 28 13 26
20 23 11 14 56 43 40 3 33 26 10 19 10 18 11 25 4

this is it largo… if you need i can show it from a spreadsheet view but i will have to take a pic of it and post it cheers

I use Microsoft Snipping Tool, a utility that should be on your computer, and then I copy and paste into Paint.

16
14 32
12 30 1
10 28 22 31
8 26 33 19 10
6 24 26 23 52 25
4 22 39 45 9 4 13
2 20 19 30 50 10 28 13
17 5 36 6 17 17 15 19 53
15 33 34 43 48 55 36 27 62 34
13 31 41 5 19 6 16 46 36 51 31
11 29 40 16 47 7 24 23 51 43 14 20
9 27 13 3 54 44 31 49 3 23 5 19 44
7 25 21 19 53 21 50 41 19 41 27 37 21 19
5 23 15 5 19 16 11 15 19 19 11 14 20 53 55
3 21 38 8 51 51 40 47 29 38 48 30 50 36 39 15
1 19 37 44 11 56 8 60 31 40 54 41 18 61 8 37 33
18 35 7 49 30 59 40 63 55 19 6 22 16 2 28 20 33
20 5 40 23 38 18 34 20 23 29 42 32 47 5 6 54 56
42 37 51 58 19 20 29 37 51 63 18 35 21 19 1 30 58
46 3 57 22 16 5 61 52 3 15 12 20 56 23 23 11
5 19 32 39 19 20 28 58 19 20 45 12 36 46 44
22 16 61 7 25 53 36 48 19 36 19 40 48 39
21 37 8 2 50 51 8 50 16 36 26 29 42
17 6 50 11 11 28 38 57 13 19 17 5
55 3 3 19 53 4 32 11 5 51 1
38 36 34 50 56 7 26 21 36 37
16 47 7 53 23 51 14 55 19
40 51 30 31 29 42 20 31
6 59 40 63 9 27 62
34 28 13 26 20 23
11 14 56 43 40
3 33 26 10
19 10 18
11 25
4

it comes out in a different shape but the same format when i post it through???

took a photo of the format but it wont let me load it to big it says? sorry largo frustrated to the heavens such a simple pic wont load and it tells the story..

The file is too big, maximum allowed size is 256 KiB. wtf its a i phone pic shot

Thank you Mr lowe. You could try this:

Set the focus on the window you want a screenshot of. Then press Alt+Print at the same time. Then open Paint and press Ctrl+V or choose "insert" from the menu. Then save as .jpg. This should be small enough. If not, simply resize the image again.

This type of transposition cipher is simple to make. pen and paper and scissors. No computers. Write out your plain text on grid paper cut either rows or columns. put it back together in a different format (many options) and you have a jumbled code. the above columns odds evens one shift up gives near period 19 with very high bigram result. no solve but it interests me because of its simplicity.
may be i will try odds evens columns then cut into odds evens rows.. a double transposition..sooo many options.

This type of transposition cipher is simple to make. pen and paper and scissors. No computers. Write out your plain text on grid paper cut either rows or columns. put it back together in a different format (many options) and you have a jumbled code. the above columns odds evens one shift up gives near period 19 with very high bigram result. no solve but it interests me because of its simplicity.
may be i will try odds evens columns then cut into odds evens rows.. a double transposition..sooo many options.

Cool idea. Can anyone make a cipher like that to see if it solves?

Thank you, Mr. lowe. I like the idea because it is indeed very easy to do with pen and paper and yet very effective. But as you said, there are a lot of ways to arrange the columns. If Zodiac did it the way shown or similar, I think he chose a straight-forward pattern. Like on the screenshot or something like that. I always have the hope that he wanted z340 to be solved. In this case he hopefully chose a pattern that can be guessed.

Cool idea. Can anyone make a cipher like that to see if it solves?

I’ll try it today or tomorrow.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator

Here’s a cipher based on Mr lowe’s idea:

QoXd=YKAKh;j::acr
UqxKjvSULEwu3y:hI
+v5hMXco0PFY9:Cj5
87QRAs;;ufD4aax5q
cNCJ3LE5yv:h7+;=b
iiw27lAp0dNeosdeX
PinSpfJc9Zz;2p=C;
adqNLKDITua7YXxI;
eP4:5k=yE==kwj+G;
FXa8=XHZI;hVrJLct
CPZdDpnI5RhitttZf
TnuAQNqc7dPELq:aV
C=Mwuby8kA5UhxcCs
Qp:euF9yjpDJqUlVi
RN+P:jiDPf5tuEYsh
bUDpT9RoQAew:cuCi
TnZU;d=0=XaJ=5:u8
hF=iv9ggS1sIza;K+
NBU0rHzP4l;wEIcwf
T;Gl:hlcgVapTYhll

I just started the transposition solver of AZDecrypt, but removed the two options "L-Route" and "Spiral". Otherwise I left all settings on default.
The cipher has a bigram peak at P19 and the Deceptive Periods test seems to confirm this (little noise).
Mr lowe, your idea is really great. Let’s see if AZDecrypt can crack that.

No solve yet…

By the way: the "one column up" after odd/even columns is almost the same like a diagonal transposition which is almost the same like p18. I think I’ve posted something similar a year ago but I can’t find the thread.
As you can see, there are many possibilities (Odd/Even columns and then P18, Diagonal or one column up), which are very similar in the core. The resulting ciphers don’t differ much, but the small difference can be the boundary between "solvable" and "unsolvable". I like your idea more and more…z340 could be based on such a creative approach.

Here is a weak solve (overnight run):

Score: 20708.48 IOC: 0.07133 Multiplicity: 0.18235
Repeats: 453 PC-cycles: 2515 Hours: 7.05

Skytale(UTP,P:179)
Offset column order(17*20,X:8)
Offset row order(229*2,Y:1)

EWORNINPARATIALLI
ENITIEASALLBERKEK
ARTOFATIATHAESHLA
ITHADARLTHEBESTPI
TINGTOURROCKSOFFS
EVENBETTERTHANGET
LINDESPERENCEETIS
VEAMETHEMOATTHRIL
TOKILLSOMETHINGDI
TFOREANAMALOFALLT
ALLSTHEMOATYANDER
TOUSSTBECARSEMANI
CAUSEMEINTHEFORRE
NAMEWELLINGSILYGA
VETORMTEFUNTHANKI
ILLNOTDAUNATIAMOF
TALAVESISSSOMUCHF
ILLBECOMEMAUSEATI
HAVEKILLERSPLEWEC
CEANYALLTHEANDPEO

Largo, can you describe the transposition steps in detail please? I may want to add this to the menu. Thanks.

Here is a weak solve (overnight run):

Score: 20708.48 IOC: 0.07133 Multiplicity: 0.18235
Repeats: 453 PC-cycles: 2515 Hours: 7.05

Skytale(UTP,P:179)
Offset column order(17*20,X:8)
Offset row order(229*2,Y:1)

EWORNINPARATIALLI
ENITIEASALLBERKEK
ARTOFATIATHAESHLA
ITHADARLTHEBESTPI
TINGTOURROCKSOFFS
EVENBETTERTHANGET
LINDESPERENCEETIS
VEAMETHEMOATTHRIL
TOKILLSOMETHINGDI
TFOREANAMALOFALLT
ALLSTHEMOATYANDER
TOUSSTBECARSEMANI
CAUSEMEINTHEFORRE
NAMEWELLINGSILYGA
VETORMTEFUNTHANKI
ILLNOTDAUNATIAMOF
TALAVESISSSOMUCHF
ILLBECOMEMAUSEATI
HAVEKILLERSPLEWEC
CEANYALLTHEANDPEO

Largo, can you describe the transposition steps in detail please? I may want to add this to the menu. Thanks.

EWORNINPARATIALLI
ENITIEASALLBERKEK
ARTOFATIATHAESHLA
ITHADARLTHE BESTPI
TING TOUR ROCKS OFF S
EVEN BETTER THAN GET
LINDESPERENCEETIS
VEA ME THE MOAT THRIL
TO KILL SOMETHING DI
TFORE ANAMAL OF ALLT
ALLSTHEMOATYANDER
TOUSST BE CARSEMANI
CAUSE ME IN THEFORRE
NAMEWELLINGSILYGA
VETORMTE FUN THAN KI
ILL NOT DAUNATIAM OF
TALAVESISS SO MUCH F
ILL BE COMEMAUSEAT I
HAVE KILLERSPLEWEC
CEANYALLTHEANDPEO

its interesting the scytale gets a partial solve even if it is bottom too top in sections?