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ancient greek musical notation

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Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

old "code" Greek musical, a mystery not yet solved. (It may be a scam.
Share this link, for those who do not know of course, because some symbols are similar to ZMF.
Marcelo :)
http://ancientgreekmusicalnotation.co.uk/Other-Musical-Diagrams.php

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : October 30, 2015 8:33 am
(@pinkphantom)
Posts: 556
Honorable Member
 

Hmm I’ve studied music/notation most of my life and have never seen anything like this, although the modes are definitely fimiliar just not the symbols. There is a mathematical equation to the modes – as far as fingering and notation are concerned. Going to look back over the modes and see how those symbols might fit in.

It may be that:

Lydian mode begins with C with an emphasis on the 4th note in the sequence changing. So I just have to transpose the scales as they exist and relate them to these symbols.

So I think the codes are just based off of the scale, which note changes mode, and if the scale is ascending or descending.

I will need to look at the symbols tonight and write out the probable notation associated with them.

Glad there’s something here I can actually help with lol considering ciphers aren’t my strong suit (and I admire those who find it to be one!)

But for now to start you off:

"Early Greek treatises on music do not use the term "mode" (which comes from Latin), but do describe three interrelated concepts that are related to the later, medieval idea of "mode": (1) scales (or "systems"), (2) tonos—pl. tonoi—(the more usual term used in medieval theory for what later came to be called "mode"), and (3) harmonia (harmony)—pl. harmoniai—this third term subsuming the corresponding tonoi but not necessarily the converse (Mathiesen 2001a, 6(iii)(e))."

The Greek scales in the Aristoxenian tradition were (Barbera 1984, 240; Mathiesen 2001a, 6(iii)(d)):

Mixolydian: hypate hypaton–paramese (b–b′)
Lydian: parhypate hypaton–trite diezeugmenon (c′–c″)
Phrygian: lichanos hypaton–paranete diezeugmenon (d′–d″)
Dorian: hypate meson–nete diezeugmenon (e′–e″)
Hypolydian: parhypate meson–trite hyperbolaion (f′–f″)
Hypophrygian: lichanos meson–paranete hyperbolaion (g′–g″)
Common, Locrian, or Hypodorian: mese–nete hyperbolaion or proslambnomenos–mese (a′–a″ or a–a′)
These names are derived from Ancient Greek subgroups (Dorians), one small region in central Greece (Locris), and certain neighboring (non-Greek) peoples from Asia Minor (Lydia, Phrygia). The association of these ethnic names with the octave species appears to precede Aristoxenus, who criticized their application to the tonoi by the earlier theorists whom he called the Harmonicists (Mathiesen 2001a, 6(iii)(d)).

Depending on the positioning (spacing) of the interposed tones in the tetrachords, three genera of the seven octave species can be recognized. The diatonic genus (composed of tones and semitones), the chromatic genus (semitones and a minor third), and the enharmonic genus (with a major third and two quarter tones or dieses) (Cleonides 1965, 35–36). The framing interval of the perfect fourth is fixed, while the two internal pitches are movable. Within the basic forms, the intervals of the chromatic and diatonic genera were varied further by three and two "shades" (chroai), respectively (Cleonides 1965, 39–40; Mathiesen 2001a, 6(iii)(c)).

In contrast to the medieval modal system, these scales and their related tonoi and harmoniai appear to have had no hierarchical relationships amongst the notes that could establish contrasting points of tension and rest, although the mese ("middle note") may have had some sort of gravitational function (Palisca 2006, 77)."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mode_(music )

 
Posted : October 30, 2015 7:53 pm
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

Hmm I’ve studied music/notation most of my life and have never seen anything like this, although the modes are definitely fimiliar just not the symbols. There is a mathematical equation to the modes – as far as fingering and notation are concerned. Going to look back over the modes and see how those symbols might fit in.

But for now to start you off:

"Early Greek treatises on music do not use the term "mode" (which comes from Latin), but do describe three interrelated concepts that are related to the later, medieval idea of "mode": (1) scales (or "systems"), (2) tonos—pl. tonoi—(the more usual term used in medieval theory for what later came to be called "mode"), and (3) harmonia (harmony)—pl. harmoniai—this third term subsuming the corresponding tonoi but not necessarily the converse (Mathiesen 2001a, 6(iii)(e))."

The Greek scales in the Aristoxenian tradition were (Barbera 1984, 240; Mathiesen 2001a, 6(iii)(d)):

Mixolydian: hypate hypaton–paramese (b–b′)
Lydian: parhypate hypaton–trite diezeugmenon (c′–c″)
Phrygian: lichanos hypaton–paranete diezeugmenon (d′–d″)
Dorian: hypate meson–nete diezeugmenon (e′–e″)
Hypolydian: parhypate meson–trite hyperbolaion (f′–f″)
Hypophrygian: lichanos meson–paranete hyperbolaion (g′–g″)
Common, Locrian, or Hypodorian: mese–nete hyperbolaion or proslambnomenos–mese (a′–a″ or a–a′)
These names are derived from Ancient Greek subgroups (Dorians), one small region in central Greece (Locris), and certain neighboring (non-Greek) peoples from Asia Minor (Lydia, Phrygia). The association of these ethnic names with the octave species appears to precede Aristoxenus, who criticized their application to the tonoi by the earlier theorists whom he called the Harmonicists (Mathiesen 2001a, 6(iii)(d)).

Depending on the positioning (spacing) of the interposed tones in the tetrachords, three genera of the seven octave species can be recognized. The diatonic genus (composed of tones and semitones), the chromatic genus (semitones and a minor third), and the enharmonic genus (with a major third and two quarter tones or dieses) (Cleonides 1965, 35–36). The framing interval of the perfect fourth is fixed, while the two internal pitches are movable. Within the basic forms, the intervals of the chromatic and diatonic genera were varied further by three and two "shades" (chroai), respectively (Cleonides 1965, 39–40; Mathiesen 2001a, 6(iii)(c)).

In contrast to the medieval modal system, these scales and their related tonoi and harmoniai appear to have had no hierarchical relationships amongst the notes that could establish contrasting points of tension and rest, although the mese ("middle note") may have had some sort of gravitational function (Palisca 2006, 77)."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mode_(music )

Very cool, hope you successful, this mystery is quite interesting. I do not have a clue or knowledge for this :mrgreen: (as well as the ZMF codes, just like playing with ideas out of the box)
Marcelo :)

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : October 30, 2015 8:12 pm
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

PinkPhantom,(talking about music) Look at this digression I did,
I know nothing about music and its nuances, separated only letters in 340, thereby making this "graphic" can be somewhere around music :?: :?:
I know it sounds silly (and probably is) but anyway …
Marcelo :D

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : October 30, 2015 9:14 pm
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