I would be very confident in saying that we have a good understanding of the Zodiacs humor, it’s not something that can be faked, you can’t fake what you find funny, because unless you find it funny it will… look do I really need to explain this? We can be very certain that he was sardonic and sarcastic in real life and this humor appeals to much less than half the population. We can also be certain that he had a decent sized ego. It’s very unlikely that people didn’t notice these traits, its simply that no one would connect them with serial killing.

Yes, but that’s fairly different to the matter of "britishism".

On the matter of ego, it’s a mistake to assume the writer had one outside the realms of his letters.

On the matter of humor, you have a valid point, but i could shout forever that Allen doesn’t match that characteristic and it will amount to nothing.

Ultimately you are spinning your wheels to find the same conclusions that psychological profiling has allready done.

While I started the I’m offended bit, I did also point out that I didn’t see any obvious Britishisms in the zodiac correspondence, my "upper class" father using a phrase the zodiac used which I believe the fbi deemed to be texan and also the victom for victim spelling. I’ve heard all forms of English spoken for nearly 55 years now, and nothing has ever struck me as someone trying to sound English in zodiac letters. The title of this thread is Z s most distinctive trait IMO, but I’m saying this trait is far from distinctive from an English standpoint,particularly if you want to down play the role of comic book obsession, which you do. The use of the hood with HIS SYMBOL ON It, at LB, screams supervillain. A trait which I think has never been explored at length is whether or not he was autistic spectrum, which I am(autistic and British? What a poor bugger I am!!!!!!!) That’s worthy of a new thread which I can’t be bothered to start, but will happily comment on should anyone fancy doing it. May have come off as over sensitive, but as an English man I’ve had a long time to be fed up of the limey, must be a fag, drinks warm beer kind of crap that has filtered over here for decades

Ultimately you are spinning your wheels to find the same conclusions that psychological profiling has allready done.

Really, I’ve read few of the more zany profiles from the era, but I thought most of them were a bit outlandish.

I can’t really comprehend the idea of someone being able to hide their ego. I have thought, if there’s one thing you can’t hide about your personality it is your ego, at least not to anyone remotely close to you.

I believe it is possible to accurately profile the Zodiac. He attempts to mislead and he spoon feeds information in an attempt to trick us, but he reveals things that are almost certainly authentic. He lets his sense of humor slip entirely, he unmistakably reveals his interests. Some of these are things that cannot be part of his fantasy persona.

If these profiles already exist, I would use them to examine the lives of people surrounding any POI. Did your POI associate with people who would tolerate this kind of personality, such as, theatre people, nerds, counter-culture types, writers, eccentric types? Whoever he was he wouldn’t fit into a lot of social groups. Do any of your POI’s have relatives who display wit, or use understatements; formal, or old fashion language? Are any of them from middle class backgrounds, but more cultured in tastes than is usual? Do any of them have relatives who displayed magical thinking, or suffered from any mental illness?

I’ll state someone things that I think are more second tier speculation.

I think that the Zodiac was from a middle class American home, likely somewhat conservative, perhaps actively religious. I’ve notice the Zodiac never swore (different times I know), and there’s some invisible line to his crassness that I feel most criminals would cross. He has an infantile sense of naughty words and his idea of what is shocking reveals a strange sense of what’s "proper".

I think he’s something of a pseudo-intellectual, I believe his infantile and mental issues would have prevented him from being a disciplined academic. He is creative though and didactic, there’s almost a sense of this untrained brilliance.

I think he would actively mix high and low humor, alternating between wit and somewhat disgusting things, but again, no swears.

While I started the I’m offended bit, I did also point out that I didn’t see any obvious Britishisms in the zodiac correspondence, my "upper class" father using a phrase the zodiac used which I believe the fbi deemed to be texan and also the victom for victim spelling. I’ve heard all forms of English spoken for nearly 55 years now, and nothing has ever struck me as someone trying to sound English in zodiac letters. The title of this thread is Z s most distinctive trait IMO, but I’m saying this trait is far from distinctive from an English standpoint,particularly if you want to down play the role of comic book obsession, which you do. The use of the hood with HIS SYMBOL ON It, at LB, screams supervillain. A trait which I think has never been explored at length is whether or not he was autistic spectrum, which I am(autistic and British? What a poor bugger I am!!!!!!!) That’s worthy of a new thread which I can’t be bothered to start, but will happily comment on should anyone fancy doing it. May have come off as over sensitive, but as an English man I’ve had a long time to be fed up of the limey, must be a fag, drinks warm beer kind of crap that has filtered over here for decades

I gotta say I reread what I wrote after a nights rest and I was offended

I have no doubt he enjoyed comic books, but I’d suggest he enjoyed regular books just as much. He’s clearly got a love for certain pop culture and much of it is middle class. And yes the supervillian angle is of great interest, I mean he pushes it so hard, it had to pop out elsewhere in his life. I can’t think of any serial killer who went to such pains to create such an elaborate mythos and the supervillian is central to it.

I believe the Zodiac was American, and it would have been difficult for him to know which words were more common on the otherside of the pond. But it’s not so much the words, but more so the idea’s. He uses American words for the most, but to convey idea’s that are not part of American mainstream culture. His use of understatements for humor are the best example. Once you see it, you can’t unsee it.

And he doesn’t sound so much British as he does pretentious.

He could have learnt the habits from a lot of places, comic books, cinema, theatre, book books. It’s likely all of them.

Anyway, none of this is very persuasive, I’m falling into the trap of rehashing without providing anything of substance again. So look at the examples provided, research them. And I should do the same instead of waffling.

These matters are so complex if you were to ascertain anything substantial it would require neglecting so many things.

You are Zoming in too closely, step back and look.

Keep it simple.
1968-1970
A man is angry about something. about what?
yes there is a element of didacticism, but what was it? i’ve suggested this prior.
A varying degree of Schizoid personality disorder present
-escapism – what from in his life?

I’m not sure you’ll find the answers in his writings, we can speculate all we like but the paragraph above will be relevant and will be answered if and when Zodiac is ever caught.

Everything else is speculation, saying he was a pseudo-intellect incable of formal education neglects the transient varying aspects of mental illness, physical illness, life itself, environments of individuals at given times it’s so complex over a span of decades, and then there’s the countless other things.

keep it simple.

A trait which I think has never been explored at length is whether or not he was autistic spectrum, which I am(autistic and British? What a poor bugger I am!!!!!!!)

So am I. This case is actually a "special interest" of mine.

Zodiac’s pedantic writing and speaking style definitely corresponds to autism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stilted_speech

Hi Jacob, yeah I’ve got special interests galore and by Christ do people suffer them!!!!!! I have to put the exclamation marks cos I don’t get the faces!! Must be higher up the spectrum than I thought

You’re right, Jacob, about the pedantic writing and speaking style corresponding to autism, and also his walk being described as unusual. Possibly a reason for him not having much luck with the opposite sex if he came off as geeky or weird(autism and aspergers were not such a"thing"back then, unlikely he was diagnosed if mild or high functioning). Would also explain being good at codes and ciphers(recognising patterns) and being obsessed with things such as comic books or anything else he may have had access to. There’s loads more once you go down the autism road, that’s why I’m surprised I haven’t seen much mention of it before. Interesting to see what others think, but that would mean starting that thread I couldn’t arsed with!

Agreed egan, your thoughts on this reflect my own. Zodiac’s "schizophrenic gait" may actually have been coordination disorder which is common with autism. Comic books, Gilbert & Sullivan, guns, codes etc. may have been special interests. Autism might make more sense than schizophrenia in his case. It might explain why he had schizophrenic-like symptoms but also an ability to carry out these complex plans.

Exactly

He was also annoyed by loud "squealing" motorcycles. When he spoke to Nancy Slover over the phone he dominated the conversation as if he was reading from a script. If he did encounter the SFPD in 1969, he was somehow unflappable enough to have evaded detection – his facial expression not registering any fright. All seems true to autism.

He was not schizophrenic nor Autistic and certainly not a schizophrenic autistic.

These are serious debilitating conditions of which there is no basis to suspect Zodiac was suffering from in 1968-70.

He was not schizophrenic nor Autistic and certainly not a schizophrenic autistic.

These are serious debilitating conditions of which there is no basis to suspect Zodiac was suffering from in 1968-70.

I know autism is, I live with it every day. Two people with this condition might know more about this topic than you do.

Here Schizoid symptoms ala wiki
Emotional coldness and reduced affect display,
few or no close friends,
indifference to criticism and praise,
anhedonia,
unintentional insensitivity to social norms;
asexual tendencies,
excessive preoccupation with fantasy,
autistic thinking without loss of skill to recognize reality

With a bunch of other personality traits.

Psychiatric wise:
Anxiety in 1968-1970
Dysthymia – id say much of his youth.
Major Depressive (with possible psychotic episodes) in 1968-1970
Cyclothymia (possibly had a "double depression" in 68.)
Suicidal

His environment at the time was:
Unstable
He had a gripe about something
lonely
Something happened to him that exasperated his illness probably years prior.

Substance abuse wise:
Alcohol highly likely To be a heavy drinker at times
slight chance of amphetamine use.

Thanks, simplicity, for your derisory comments. Unless you’re zodiac, may I suggest that your opinions are no more valid than ours, and autism is not necessarily as debilitating as you assume, unless you think autism is rain man. Your opinion of "autistics" has been noted. My opinion of you I can’t be bothered to lower myself to express.