…In fact, I won’t fall from the chair if it was the same case with Donna Lass, someone close enough to her (knew her landlord and boss’ numbers) did killed her and made his way with the body, "zodiac" (if he indeed was the 35-45 yo merchant mariner who spoke with Robert Tarbox back in 1972) read about it and decided to "hitch a ride" upon that as well.

I agree with most everything you wrote, but wanted to touch base on the above. I think the "mysterious phone calls" to her landlord and place of work are just misconceptions. Neither the landlord, nor employer mention an unknown caller.

It was suggested by the Douglas County Sheriff’s Department her health may have been an issue. Here is the thread about it. More "stories" gone way awry, imo.

viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1527

Let’s not forget too, Donna Lass was merely an assumption.

****
Zodiac–smoke and mirrors. Lies mixed with truths. Pissed off when he told the truth…and not so much when he lied.

"I believe he learned of Donald Fouke’s testimony from the papers."

When Zodiac mailed the Bus Bomb letter on November 9th 1969 claiming "two cops pulled a goof", Zodiac was telling the truth. Donald Fouke’s testimony was never in the papers, and neither was the sighting of Zodiac on Jackson St.
The admission by police was only issued in a memorandum by Donald Fouke on November 12th 1970. The only way Zodiac could know he passed 2 cops on Jackson St, is if he was there. Additionally Fouke stated in the Crimes of the Century documentary in 1989 that he got the amended radio description while on Arguello Street (Boulevard). Why is an officer of SFPD heading away from Washington and Cherry, away from the crime scene and away from an assault and robbery on a taxicab driver, when he should have been heading towards it. The answer is, he was directed there by Zodiac. The Zodiac told no lies in the October 13th or November 9th letters concerning his movements that night. Unfortunately the police were less than forthcoming.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_A3kD-j … u.be&t=57s

If zodiac was anything he was a manipulator, and I would say, a masterful one.

Soze

"It was suggested by the Douglas County Sheriff’s Department her health may have been an issue."
..Testimony from mr. Nick Davis ,former manager of the Monte Verde Apartments[DL stayed one night here],discloses that he had received a call from the Security Office of Sahara Tahoe on Friday ,Sept 11,1970. He, in turn, called the South Lake Tahoe Police Dept.and talked with dispatcher Bob Morgan.
Mr Morgan revealed that he had a call from Douglass County Sheriff’s Office about the subject[DL] ,and he understood that there was some sickness in the family. He felt that Under Sherriff Bradovich was the one who raised the question of subject’s health ,and that subsequent conversations carried the health aspect,and that he,mr Davis, then called back to the Sahara Tahoe,and said there was a health problem,and that Gordon Petrovich misunderstood it to be in the earlier part of the week,the 7th or the 8th.,when it was in fact on the 11th,Friday…

Donna was last seen at 1.50 am, when the pen trailed from her notepad. She apparently was in good spirits according to Joan Bentley. She was abducted in the car park of the casino. Nothing else would explain her not meeting her friend Jo Anne Goettsche at 2.00 am. This woman had traveled all the way from San Francisco to spend Labor Day weekend with Donna Lass. We cannot believe that Donna Lass in a perfectly good mood, just couldn’t be bothered to meet her friend in just 10 minutes time, and just left the casino on foot, snubbing her friend, who had just traveled 190 miles. There may be confusion whether the mystery caller rang her landlord, the casino or Douglas County Sheriff’s Office, or any combination, but a call was received claiming the family illness. This can only be viewed as suspicious, because Donna wasn’t in her Chevrolet Camaro that night and her friend was only minutes away, about to meet with her and drive her back to the Monte Verdi apartments. A clear indication the family illness was a ruse.

If anything the "zodiac" killer was a live action version of South Park’s "Professor Chaos", I can’t get a different opinion of this lame chubby guy but to compare him to Butters Stotch. I think he only resorted into killing innocents due to him probably being "just the punching bag" at school while growing up.

If Tarbox did met him (thus the merchant mariner is the zodiac), he mentioned he was a 5’10"-5’11" and heavy 40 years old French Mediterranean looking guy with a normal American name (of Northern European origin despite his non-fitting ethnic background) who lived in "the worst address anyone can have".

Richard—I replied to you in the Donna Lass thread. I don’t want to hijack this one…just wanted to bring to light the possibility of more rubbish.

It’s also (as noted before) weird that if the man whom Eric Zelms had stopped the car for so he’d cross the street wasn’t covered with blood on his clothes considering the amount of blood in Paul Stine’s cab and that he had to place the bleeding dying Stine upon his laps so he’d be able to crop his shirt’s tail.

Armond Pelissetti said that Jackson street was actually a well lit street so he won’t count the man who Donald Fouke saw as the suspect if he wasn’t covered in blood (or at least had some shining blood stains on his clothes). Pelissetti adds in the 2007 "this is the zodiac speaking" documentary that Fouke told him on a "subsequent occasion" they had stopped the guy for a quick questioning before letting him go, but Fouke denies that.

Is there anything official about Zelms’ view of this incident? I know he died while on duty on January 1st, 1970 but I guess he may have told his wife something.

Mrs. Zelms reportedly stated that her husband had confessed that Fouke was the one who wanted to lie about the stop. Zelms also was so distraught by this failure to stop the Zodiac that he carried the composite sketch with him daily in search of the killer. Zelms reportedly told his wife that he and Fouke had spoken to the killer, “face to face,” and that the man was calm and answered questions. http://www.zodiackillerfacts.com/forum/ … f=21&t=543

The teenagers only believed they saw Zodiac with Stine’s head in his lap. It may have appeared to them he did, but highly unlikely a murderer would place a profusely bleeding victim’s head in his lap, deliberately getting soaked in blood before walking in a built-up area like Presidio Heights. There is no reason for Zodiac to have any blood on his clothes, only a little on his hands due to handling the shirt piece.

If the zodiac was in the front seat and, if he had Paul’s head in his lap, I would think only the left side of the zodiac body would have blood on it. The zodiac travelling up Jackson would only have the right side of his body exposed to the police travelling from the opposite direction. Might explain what ever that "lope" is. Seeing a car come and him trying to hide his left side.

Soze

Thanks, Which again refutes his claim the 2 cops have ever stopped him and talked to him since he wouldn’t be approaching them like a crab only going in a half body exposed form, he’d have to reveal his full body to approach and talk with them and if he was stopped that shortly after the murder he’d be identified for sure with his bloody left side and **perhaps** strong smell of blood "dropping" from his bloodstained clothes.

But would you see blood on a man in dark clothing, on a poorly lit street? Doubtful that he was dripping in blood.

Concerning people who don’t believe that the man Fouke and Zelms stopped could bee the zodiac killer because
"if he was the Zodiac killer he would have had blood all over his pants because he had Paul Stines head in his lap while tearing of the piece of Stines shirt etc"

Well…Donald Fouke wrote in his memo that the man they stopped, who many believe to be the Zodiac killer (myself included), was wearing:

"Brown wool pants pleeted type baggy in rear (rust brown)"

Now, if a pair of brown wool pants was full of blood what color would they then turn into ?

Imho; RUST BROWN

Here is a copy of Fouke’s memo:

Sorry but the pedagogue in me feels the need to point out that an average IQ is 100, with college graduates scoring about 115. Don’t know how you arrived at Zodiac’s IQ, but 115-120 is pretty bright. Well above average, even considering IQ is fluid and subject to change. I believe Ted Buddy scored at 120 and ALA was in the 130s. Probably a much lower EQ.

I don’t know (like all of you) what have really occurred on that night when cabdriver Paul Stine was murdered but something isn’t right with the claim of the zodiac killer. It took him almost a month (9/11/1969 – where he stated clearly to give the police false/fake "clews"/clues to ran across so they’ll never find him) to allegedly recall an encounter with the SFPD when all he was after in his letters was taunting the police of how "smart he is" and how "incompetent they are"? I believe he learned of Donald Fouke’s testimony from the papers (after the San Francisco Police Department’s sketch was modified according to the notes Fouke had) and used that "running into a pedestrian at Jackson Street" to mess with them and with the media. This whole section which was marked by him as "MUST PRINT IN PAPER" was made up for that very reason. Don’t forget he he already mailed two letters since the Paul Stine murder prior that one and never mentioned such an event when the whole SF Bay Area were terrorized, so it gives away his scheme.

The funny thing is that in October 13th, 1969 letter he mailed 2 days after the Paul Stine slaying he claimed the "closest" the police ever came to him was only when he came out of cover ("The S.F. Police could have caught me last night if they had searched the park properly instead of holding road races with their motorcicles seeing who could make the most noise. The car drivers should have just parked their cars and sat there quietly waiting for me to come out of cover.") – it’s like he’s incoherent with his own tales and is clumsy even with such simple task as lying.

It wasn’t the only time "zodiac" proven to us he was full of shit, the same thing happened a day prior (8/11/1969) to the note where he "confessed" for having a small talk with two cops who "ran into him 3 minutes after he left the cab" and deceived them into going the other way around. In that November 8th, 1969 letter he claimed to have already killed 7 victims since December 1968 (counting as follow: Dec., July, August, September, October), yet at 27/9/1969 when he (if it was indeed him who committed the Cecilia Shepard’s murder) listed the murders he committed on Bryan Hartnell’s Carmen Ghia, he never mentioned to have operated on August.

That very same thing occurred when somebody in Los Angeles called Paul Avery and said that the zodiac was "most likely" the same man who killed Cheri Joe Bates on October’s 30th of 1966 at Riverside City College zodiac took credit (13/03/1971 letter) for it even if there was nothing connecting him to the case because he enjoyed the terror he inflicted into people’s hearts and the false "power position" it gave him, and to do so he "gave credit to the Police" for "stumbling his Riverside activity" (which NOW I tend to believe he didn’t do as the handwriting on the 3 "Bates had to die" didn’t match his own from ~3 years later and also the "confession letter" and fake "fellow student" letters were made through a typing machine and sending photocopied versions not on the method of handwriting and actual/original copy mailing the zodiac used, if he was so "smart" he wouldn’t revert to a tactic where his traceable actual palm print is left on the paper – all the connection I may see is the "z" at the bottom of the 3 letters and the usage of 2 stamps on each letter/envalope as the "zodiac" did – yet, I don’t think it’s strong enough evidence). If he was brave as he wished to be viewed, he didn’t managed to pull it off in this case, the "confession letter" author spoke of prior murders before Bates yet "zodiac" stated in the ending of that very same 9/11/1969 letter "To prove that I am the Zodiac, Ask the Vallejo cop about my electric gun sight which I used to start my collecting of slaves" meaning he just begun his killing spree with David Faraday and Betty-Lou Jensen at Lake Herman Road (20/12/1968).

The same case of being full of shit had happened to him with Kathleen Jones, it is clear as heck he was following the news/media in general to see what they were
reporting about him and once he heard of that alleged abduction attempt by him (that was committed by some other murican psycho, like there are not too many of them already in that immigrants’ "melting pot") he rode upon that as he did with the Cheri Jo Bates’ case, simply because it could benefit him and his desired "evil mastermind who lurks everywhere" public image. In fact, I won’t fall from the chair if it was the same case with Donna Lass, someone close enough to her (knew her landlord and boss’ numbers) did killed her and made his way with the body, "zodiac" (if he indeed was the 35-45 yo merchant mariner who spoke with Robert Tarbox back in 1972) read about it and decided to "hitch a ride" upon that as well.

All I can say about this guy is that he’s roughly 115-120 in terms of IQ scoring, obviously not a "genius". evil? yes, cruel? yes, but not the smartest guy around. If it was indeed one guy and not a "zodiac crew" – I sometimes think these 4 dots he drew on the ZVF symbol may have mean that there wasn’t just one guy involved (as both Mike Meageu and the 3 teenagers who saw him wiping Stine’s cab stated he was a 25-30 years old, over 102 KG, roughly 5’8"-5’9" and not a 5’11"-6’0" guy as Cecilia Shepard described her murderer to be nor 35-45 yo "who weighs 100 pounds less than Arthur Leigh Allen" as Donald Fouke described him).

Even his "crackproof" ciphers are stupid and rather childish, making up a "secret code language" he used for his ciphers is something not so brilliant when you think of it, it’s something we used to do as elementary kids who already mastered the "ordinary ABC".

You have the age of Zodiac wrong:

Here are all witness description of the suspect, believed to be the Zodiac killer,
observed at the Paul Stine murder October 11, 1969.

http://www.zodiackiller.com/StineReport2.html

Quote from police report, dated October 12, 1969, 12:30 AM:

WMA, in his early forties, 5’8" , heavy build, reddish-blond "crew-cut" hair, wearing eyeglasses, dark brown trousers, dark (navy blue or black) "Parka" jacket, dark shoes. Suspect should have many blood stains on his person and clothing

http://www.zodiackiller.com/Composite1.html

Quote from wanted poster dated October 13, 1969

WMA, 25-30 years, 5’8" to 5’9, reddish brown hair – crew cut. heavy rim glasses, navy blue or black jacket.

https://nuclearchainsaw.files.wordpress … zodiac.jpg

Quote from wanted poster published later same day October 13, 1969:

Amended drawing.
Supplementing our bulletin 87-69 of October 13, 1969. Additional information has developed the above amended drawing of murder suspect known as "ZODIAC"

WMA, 35-45 years, approximately 5’8", heavy build, short brown hair, possibly with red tint, wear glasses.

http://www.zodiackiller.com/FoukeReport.html

Quote from patrolman Donald Fouke police report, dated November 12, 1969 :

“The suspect that was observed by officer Fouke was a WMA 35-45 Yrs about 5’10", 180-200 lbs. Medium heavy build- Barrel chested- Medium complexion- Light-colored hair possibly greying in rear (May have been lighting that caused this effect.) Crew cut- wearing glasses- Dressed in dark blue waist length zipper type jacket (Navy or royal blue) Elastic cuffs and waist band zipped part way up. Brown wool pants pleated type baggy in rear (Rust brown) May have been wearing low cut shoes. Subject at no time appeared to be in a hurry walking with a shuffling lope, Slightly bent forward. The subject’s general appearance to classifiy him as a group would be that he might be of Welsh ancestry.”