Egg, You have no idea how traumatic that event was for Kathleen Johns! She had no reason to lie about anything to get attention. People who make up lies have a hard time remembering what they have told. K Johns was very consistent in what she remembered.
She was so traumatized, that she may have thought she parked someplace else? Or the Zodiac lied and did move her car, he is the one who is not truthful! Her tire fell off very close to where she stopped, so it could have been found 3 or 4 feet from her car?
When that happened to me I was driving over 60 miles per hr and my tire flew off several feet away in an open field. She was slowly pulling out when hers fell off! The person who drove her to Patterson PD had nothing to do with moving or burning her car, that is ridiculous thinking!
She was picked up by that helpful person many miles away from her car. Read the police reports and more about the case, to get a better idea of what actually took place before accusing an innocent victim of lying! The officer who took her report scewed up and did not report everything she told him. He was a coward who was afraid of Zodiac and put her in a dark restaurant with her baby all alone to hide? I sure as hell would not trust him with my life!
Egg, You have no idea how traumatic that event was for Kathleen Johns! She had no reason to lie about anything to get attention. People who make up lies have a hard time remembering what they have told. K Johns was very consistent in what she remembered.
She was so traumatized, that she may have thought she parked someplace else? Or the Zodiac lied and did move her car, he is the one who is not truthful! Her tire fell off very close to where she stopped, so it could have been found 3 or 4 feet from her car?
When that happened to me I was driving over 60 miles per hr and my tire flew off several feet away in an open field. She was slowly pulling out when hers fell off! The person who drove her to Patterson PD had nothing to do with moving or burning her car, that is ridiculous thinking!
She was picked up by that helpful person many miles away from her car. Read the police reports and more about the case, to get a better idea of what actually took place before accusing an innocent victim of lying! The officer who took her report scewed up and did not report everything she told him. He was a coward who was afraid of Zodiac and put her in a dark restaurant with her baby all alone to hide? I sure as hell would not trust him with my life!
So the wheel came off very close to where the car was left, and the Zodiac bothered to put the wheel back on (you don’t do that in a minute, you need to jack up the car, and he would risk attracting attention/more witnesses), and torch it right there after putting the wheel back on? The only reason that would make sense is if he planned to drive it away but then decided against it and just torched it instead for whatever reason. Driving it away would have implied walking all the way back to his own car or abandoning it. Doesn’t make much sense.
Also, it was the rear right wheel that had a hub cap missing and was fastened with only two bolts, not the left one like Kathleen said. That is a pretty significant contradiction since she stated she stayed in her car while looking at him repair the wheel issue (presumably through the left mirror).
The report also clearly states that she says the man did not chase her, didn’t look for her, anything like that.
She also never mentioned he wanted to kill her in her original report, said he had been friendly, to the point where the police wasn’t even sure the guy had tried to kidnap her at all.
All indications are that she "escaped" exactly where she reported her car had been left. There is no indication she was picked up far away from the car, we don’t even know at all who drove her to the station.
The question is how Johns was picked up in one spot, driven around aimlessly for hours, then just HAPPENED to end up mere yards from her original location – apparently with no knowledge of the local area.
“Murder will out, this my conclusion.”
– Geoffrey Chaucer
The report also clearly states that she says the man did not chase her, didn’t look for her, anything like that.
She also never mentioned he wanted to kill her in her original report, said he had been friendly, to the point where the police wasn’t even sure the guy had tried to kidnap her at all.
That raises as much doubt about the police officers credibility as hers. The officer would have us believe that a terrified woman reported to him that a stranger had merely picked her up and been nice to her? The simpler explanation is that the officer was grossly bad at conducting interviews. Impatient, maybe even sexist. I mean she wasn’t there to deliver a ham sandwich to him and yet he failed to extract coherent information. The officers story makes no sense, he’s the one telling the bizarre narrative. I could be wrong, but you’d think if she was that incoherent he would have established that she was incoherent. He sounds impatient with her narrative.
It’s easy to reject her claims except for the one nagging detail… how this car helping good samaritan in the right place at the right time seems to be popping up in a few other reports that have striking similarities to the Zodiac case.
Johns certainly picked one heck of an M.O. to be faking a Zodiac attack. Why not a story about a man in a hood with a Z symbol on his chest or how she was pulled over to check on her kid when a guy with a gun showed up? Instead we get this story of a dubious tire service and a creepy car ride with a guy who seems to be second guessing what to do next. I bet he didn’t see the kid the first time.
Also Zodiac seemed to claim this one.
www.zodiachalloweencard.com has a 400 paged book for free containing the super solution with an overarching explanation of the cards and more.
The report also clearly states that she says the man did not chase her, didn’t look for her, anything like that.
She also never mentioned he wanted to kill her in her original report, said he had been friendly, to the point where the police wasn’t even sure the guy had tried to kidnap her at all.
That raises as much doubt about the police officers credibility as hers. The officer would have us believe that a terrified woman reported to him that a stranger had merely picked her up and been nice to her? The simpler explanation is that the officer was grossly bad at conducting interviews. Impatient, maybe even sexist. I mean she wasn’t there to deliver a ham sandwich to him and yet he failed to extract coherent information. The officers story makes no sense, he’s the one telling the bizarre narrative. I could be wrong, but you’d think if she was that incoherent he would have established that she was incoherent. He sounds impatient with her narrative.
Well two officers interviewed her, so you’d have to make that claim about both. The only "scary" thing she reported was that when she asked him if he often helped people he said "When I’m done with them they don’t need much help anymore" or something like that. So I have to trust the two reports of two different police officers on that. What they did say was that she was hysteric.
egg, I have no idea where you are getting your information from, but there was only one officer that night on duty at Patterson PD. He did not take notes while she was talking to him, so many things she told him were not in the report. Right or left wheel depends on how you are looking at the car, from behind the car, that rear wheel would be on the right, if you are standing in front of the car that same rear wheel would be on the left. When Zodiac first approached her he seemed friendly, he changed after that. When he sent her the Halloween card he wrote: "To the lady in the station wagon" he mentioned the color of the wagon, which was not put in the paper! She saw the lights of Tracy and her abductor said that was Tracy. She jumped out long after passing Tracy. Tracy is not close to where her car was found burned! Here is a copy and paste of a post from me as well as Howard Davis who interviewed K Johns a few times.
I have just finished listening to both sides one and two. ( Those were K Johns interviews) Howard came in on the last half of side two. Many questions were asked multiple times. But what stood out that I didn’t see in any newspaper articles was, Kathleen told about receiving the Halloween card in Oct 1970. It was like the one sent to Paul Avery, except he didn’t add the pumpkin to her card.
It was addressed to Kathleen Johns with her address, which she thought he could have gotten from the San Bernardino newspaper. She was upset that they put her address in that paper. ( I have not seen that article, but will be looking for it.)
Inside of the Halloween card was written: "To the woman in the station wagon". I have not seen the type of car she drove in any of those articles, if there is one please show it. She said that Paul A never got back to her about the card, VPD didn’t talk to her until the 1980s.
She saw Harvey more than one time, he showed her the pictures of how different Kane could look, because Kathleen said that even though she picked Kane’s picture as her abductor, she did not think that he could have been as old as Kane was at that time. Kathleen thought the guy was 25 to 30 yrs old at that time, not 46! She said he was about 5 ft 9 and large, but not fat. He had on dark-framed horn-rim glasses but had forgotten about reporting they were held on with a one-inch rubber band. She had forgotten many things which happens over the years. I could tell she was being very honest about what she did remember. She said the phone calls came right after the article came out in the paper, not before. She did say he spoke in a monotone voice and asked her to throw the baby out the window many times. When being questioned about how she thought her car could be found off of 132 when she left it on the freeway, she had no idea? She was asked if there could have been another car following the kidnapper’s car? (Mentioning the Manson family) She said no she didn’t see another car behind them. She said the car was very messy it had gum rappers and scrubbers for pots and pans on the floor if the car. Children’s clothes on the back seat of the car. After she ran from his car and hid, he came within 30 or 40 feet of her! The ride from where she hid to Patterson was about a 10 min ride.
My thought about how could he drive her car back towards 132 set it on fire and get back to his without help? ( I didn’t think, but he could have towed it?) I think he would have had to have help. He obviously knew that the truck driver who spotted him looking for Kathleen hiding in the vineyard with a flashlight had to have a CB and probably called the police. He wouldn’t have a lot of time to do what he did with her car alone, is my guess? Howard asked her if anyone tried to hypnotize her? She said yes once, but she became too upset and so it didn’t go far. Fingerprints were found on the hub cap, but no one has done any comparison to Zodiac’s prints. Kathleen has a half-brother who said that the mother’s home was broken into after Kathleen was taken for that ride. When she first saw the composite drawing at the Paterson station, she didn’t know anything about any Zodiac. Even when she was receiving odd calls, she wasn’t thinking it could be Zodiac. I think the information given by her on these CD’s confirms that only her abductor would have known the car she was driving unless we can establish it was described elsewhere. And how would anyone else know to send her the same card that Paul Avery received at about the same time? ( Minus the pumpkin)
Stanislaus County Sheriff’s Office Report: Rear left wheel (according to KJ), suspect was friendly with her, made no advances, no threats
San Joaquin Sheriff’s report: rear right wheel missing hub cap, found not far, only one loose bolt on, suspect did not leave vehicle, did not chase her, and Reed who towes the car also says rear right wheel just like Lovett saw himself
https://zodiackillerfacts.com/gallery/d … fullsize=1
Believe whatever you want to believe. I know what she told Howard and Jim Nelson and how bias the officer was who wrote his report. He did not take notes when she told him what took place , he went off of what he thought she told him, he picked and chose what he wanted in that report. He did not write a true report! Do you honestly think she faked walking in there hysterical? Whenever she was interviewed by anyone, she would break down crying telling them what happened to her. You have no idea how people back then felt about interracial marriages, let alone having a ring in her nose. Yes, many people and including Cops judge people by how they look, even today!
Back in 1970, it was much worse! He did a terrible job reporting what she told them, he took words out of context. For instance, the man was "not" threatening? He didn’t chase her, but he got within a few feet of her with his flashlight while she hid with her baby. When a trucker pulled over to see what was going on with this man in a field with a flashlight, the man got in his car and left. He knew truckers had CB radios. So the man didn’t" chase" her but he did look for her in that field.
He didn’t threaten her for several minutes, then he told her to throw the baby out the window and told her many times she was going to die. That happens to be extremely threatening! She was the only living witness to how Zodiac looked and spoke. Her description is the best of anyone else’s and should be taken seriously! ( There is one other, but I will leave that for another day)
You are ignoring the fact that the same man called her many times and sent her a Halloween card like the one sent to Paul Avery. ( That is what is called real evidence that the man was Zodiac) I hate using the word" man" when I am referring to the Zodiac! ( He is a coward, not a man. )
Believe whatever you want to believe. I know what she told Howard and Jim Nelson and how bias the officer was who wrote his report. He did not take notes when she told him what took place , he went off of what he thought she told him, he picked and chose what he wanted in that report. He did not write a true report! Do you honestly think she faked walking in there hysterical? Whenever she was interviewed by anyone, she would break down crying telling them what happened to her. You have no idea how people back then felt about interracial marriages, let alone having a ring in her nose. Yes, many people and including Cops judge people by how they look, even today!
Back in 1970, it was much worse! He did a terrible job reporting what she told them, he took words out of context. For instance, the man was "not" threatening? He didn’t chase her, but he got within a few feet of her with his flashlight while she hid with her baby. When a trucker pulled over to see what was going on with this man in a field with a flashlight, the man got in his car and left. He knew truckers had CB radios. So the man didn’t" chase" her but he did look for her in that field.
He didn’t threaten her for several minutes, then he told her to throw the baby out the window and told her many times she was going to die. That happens to be extremely threatening! She was the only living witness to how Zodiac looked and spoke. Her description is the best of anyone else’s and should be taken seriously! ( There is one other, but I will leave that for another day)
You are ignoring the fact that the same man called her many times and sent her a Halloween card like the one sent to Paul Avery. ( That is what is called real evidence that the man was Zodiac) I hate using the word" man" when I am referring to the Zodiac! ( He is a coward, not a man. )
She did not report him getting out of the car, let alone look for her with a flashlight taunting her. When they made their report, they needed to figure out if this was actually a kidnapping or not, so anything threatening was important to note to file it as such. She provided nothing that made it sound as such, no threats he would kill her or anything like that. It’s only AFTER that she added such details to her story.
For example, the police officer thinks he saw keys on the seat of the car, so he inquires to check if they are still in the car. None are found, but some people came to see the vehicle and they assume maybe they took it. So the police likely questioned her to ask if she came with a man to see the car and take the keys. Next thing you know she claims that actually, the guy had gone in to take her keys, something she had never mentioned before. Just like the story about him getting out of the car with a flashlight.
She changed her story, probably because she was annoyed that from her point of view her version was doubted, so she added bits like him taking the keys, him threatening her, him going searching for her with a flashlight. The sensible approach to this is to believe the original reports.
