Things that Zodiac did (assuming Zodiac was her abductor) that don’t seem to make sense to me…

1. When returning to Kathy’s abandoned vehicle after she had escaped, why put the wheel back on and then drive the car a distance away to burn it? Why not just burn it there where it was? Why take time to put the wheel back on when the police could be speeding toward the location? Why drive her car knowing that there will be APB’s out on her car?

2. Where was Zodiac’s vehicle when he left it to drive Kathy’s and burn it? How did he get back to his vehicle after setting fire to Kathys? The most likely scanerio is that Zodiac used his own vehicle tp tow Kathys to its final location. But again, why? Surely he must be aware that police may allready be looking for it?

Maybe Zodiac towed her vehicle and thought "If I get stopped, I will say I am simply a concerned citizen who, after finding a vehicle abandoned with its tyre missing, was towing it to safety?

2/21/13

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Zodiac didn’t offer ONE thing to prove he was the man who took KJ for her weird/intresting ride. In fact, he practically copied it from the Examiner.

I’d say…"nice try Zodiac, but no cigar".

Quoted for truth… If Zodiac didn’t have a history of this kind of plagiarism, I’d be more comfortable giving him a pass for not offering a single detail to substantiate his involvement in the Kathleen Johns episode. There are a thousand things he could have offered to substantiate his involvement and he never hesitated to offer substantiating evidence prior to the Stine murder. Afterwards… he could only parrot details offered in his favorite newspapers. He shot a man with a .38 and gave a woman her baby and intersting ride. Pretty weak effort, Z. This kind of comparison of Z’s communication to media reports is fabulous stuff, IMHO.

Wait a moment. We’re not suggesting that one of the letters is totally fake are we?

WC – the story goes that the attacker – having finished driving her around for two hours (?!) let her get away (?!) then went back to her car (?!) put the wheel back on (?!) drive the car somewhere else(?!) then got back to his own car to get away (?!) Oh! having first drawn attention to himself by torching hers (?!)

Are there elements to that story which are, perhaps, (like the letter), slightly less than believable?

Is it possible that late for her appointment with Mom, the slightly stoned Kathleen J. sparked a blunt, dropped it in the car (inadvertently setting fire to it), and then lied about it? Possible?

The only thing that really links "The Zodiac" to this crime is Kathleen’s recognition of the wanted poster, "Why that’s him, officer! That’s the man!!!" – and that he’s willing to accept responsibility for it, the rascal.

Wait a moment. We’re not suggesting that one of the letters is totally fake are we?

WC – the story goes that the attacker – having finished driving her around for two hours (?!) let her get away (?!) then went back to her car (?!) put the wheel back on (?!) drive the car somewhere else(?!) then got back to his own car to get away (?!) Oh! having first drawn attention to himself by torching hers (?!)

Are there elements to that story which are, perhaps, (like the letter), slightly less than believable?

Is it possible that late for her appointment with Mom, the slightly stoned Kathleen J. sparked a blunt, dropped it in the car (inadvertently setting fire to it), and then lied about it? Possible?

The only thing that really links "The Zodiac" to this crime is Kathleen’s recognition of the wanted poster, "Why that’s him, officer! That’s the man!!!" – and that he’s willing to accept responsibility for it, the rascal.

Smithy, yes that’s how the Kathy John’s abduction is officially said to have happened. Even the tow truck driver said all 4 wheels were on the burned out vehicle he towed away but, being aware of the claim Kathy had made with the wheel, he checked and observed the wheel only had two lug nuts holding it on. That was my point, why would Zodiac, or any other abductor for that matter, drive back to Kathy’s car, put the wheel back on, then either drive it or tow it away to a totally different area to where Kathy reported she’d been abducted from? Why not just return and set fire to it where it was?
Also, the Z composite I am highly skeptical of in how accurate it is. This is wat Fouke said about the composite.

"One month later when the composite drawing came out at Richmond Station, and was posted on the wall, he looked similar to the man that I had seen on October 11th. He (Tosci) may have been the Inspector that came out to ask me about the Composite Drawing and I told him the suspect was older and heavier" (Than he appeared in the composite drawing).

So, if the man Fouke saw on Jackson was Zodiac, that composite seem’s to have the age as looking too young and the mans weight/shap of face wrong.

Alex,

Even the tow truck driver said all 4 wheels were on the burned out vehicle he towed away but, being aware of the claim Kathy had made with the wheel, he checked and observed the wheel only had two lug nuts holding it on.

Where’d ya get that?! Even more interesting.

A story about a wheel falling off when you know you’ve only got a couple of "lug nuts" holding it on is far more feasible, I guess.
What about marks on the road, damage to the brake drum….? I’d love to know about any other physical evidence. Maybe it was "moved someplace" so they couldn’t check on that kind of detail. Hmmmmmm?

I’d also like to know how the perp got the car back onto all four wheels anyhow, without something more effective than a regular jack. When you’ve dumped a car onto a brake drum it can be a little difficult to get a wheel back on. (Ask me how I know).

Naaa, the whole things properly wacky.

I think the referrence to two lug nuts holding the wheel on was made in an effort to support Kathy’s claim. In other words, it seemed that ‘Zodiac’ had only replaced the wheel so he could move the car, so replaced the least amount of lug nuts in order to make the vehicle mobile again. Even so, I would ask again, why bother replacing any and moving the vehicle? Why not burn it where it is? Why take such a big risk hanging around the abandoned car replacing a tyre then staying with that car that you know the police are going to be looking for in that very area.

The sorce for Kathy John’s and the tow truck drivers testimony about the wheel only being secured with two lugs I can’t recall. But I’ll find it for you cause I only read it myself earlier today. It’s not in this threads articles is it, lol?

If not, i’ll find it again before the days out.

Found it. It’s a police report….

These little details have always been tantalizing

My suspect used to say, "Well laid plans of mice and men." when things didn’t go as planned. And this is why I love God, because even if an evil person is highly intelligent, and has carefully planned their crime, in the final analysis they are not in control. My suspect also used to say," Sometimes…it’s embarrassing to be a member of the Human Race." For whatever that’s worth. He also liked to scream about the millions of people that Stalin, Hitler and Mao Tse Tung killed. "Stalin, Stalin!
Stalin killed millions of people!"
I personally believe this story by Kathleen Johns, because it all very familiar to me, right down to the black bucket seats of the inside of the car, with the console in between. He didn’t think she had a baby with her when he chose her as a victim. The way he spoke to her, the calm claim that he was going to have to kill her. The physical description of this man and the way she recognized him on the wanted Poster.
She and I are the same. We got away, we survived him. I escaped into the darkness with my little ones and so did she. He was planning to kill us.

My suspect used to say, "Well laid plans of mice and men." when things didn’t go as planned. And this is why I love God, because even if an evil person is highly intelligent, and has carefully planned their crime, in the final analysis they are not in control. My suspect also used to say," Sometimes…it’s embarrassing to be a member of the Human Race." For whatever that’s worth. He also liked to scream about the millions of people that Stalin, Hitler and Mao Tse Tung killed. "Stalin, Stalin!
Stalin killed millions of people!"
I personally believe this story by Kathleen Johns, because it all very familiar to me, right down to the black bucket seats of the inside of the car, with the console in between. He didn’t think she had a baby with her when he chose her as a victim. The way he spoke to her, the calm claim that he was going to have to kill her. The physical description of this man and the way she recognized him on the wanted Poster.
She and I are the same. We got away, we survived him. I escaped into the darkness with my little ones and so did she. He was planning to kill us.

Please try to keep this on topic as it regards to JOHNS,and NOT to your personal suspect.

My suspect used to say, "Well laid plans of mice and men." when things didn’t go as planned. And this is why I love God, because even if an evil person is highly intelligent, and has carefully planned their crime, in the final analysis they are not in control. My suspect also used to say," Sometimes…it’s embarrassing to be a member of the Human Race." For whatever that’s worth. He also liked to scream about the millions of people that Stalin, Hitler and Mao Tse Tung killed. "Stalin, Stalin!
Stalin killed millions of people!"
I personally believe this story by Kathleen Johns, because it all very familiar to me, right down to the black bucket seats of the inside of the car, with the console in between. He didn’t think she had a baby with her when he chose her as a victim. The way he spoke to her, the calm claim that he was going to have to kill her. The physical description of this man and the way she recognized him on the wanted Poster.
She and I are the same. We got away, we survived him. I escaped into the darkness with my little ones and so did she. He was planning to kill us.

Well as I said in another post earlier, according to Don Fouke, the man drawn in the Presidio Composite was, quote "Similar to the man I had seen on October 11, but the suspect was older and heavier." So, if Fouke states when looking at just a facial composite that the man he saw was ‘Heavier’, that would suggest the shape of the face is wrong, probably too thin. (Mageau and his suspects ‘Round Face’, Don Fouke with Jackson Street’s ‘Barrel Chested’ indavidual, Hartnell’s "200lb plus" assailant can hardly be deduced from the Zodiac composite.

But, Kathy may very well have found herself in the clutches of a ‘Concerned Citizen’ that night who offered help to fix her unstable tyre, we’ll never know. My point was, I can understand Zodiac (assuming it was him) returning to Kaths Vehicle to maybe wipe down any prints he may have left when he went back to retreive her keys, but why take time, that he doesn’t have, to replace the tyre and then enbark on a game of vehicle hide and seek? Why didn’t he just set it alight where it was?

I think it’s simple really.

Whomever it was, imo, did NOT move Kathleen’s car.

Where her car was found was in view of the gas station Kathleen stated she could see. Had she been East of HWY 5, she would not have been able to see the gas station on Chrisman.

There would be absolutely no reason to relocate her car.

I believe the man simply loosened her lug nuts to the point the wheel was barely hangin’ on and clunking. KJ thought the entire wheel came off. We know her hubcap was found in the field right where her car was burned.

Also–I believe Kathleen stated there were no keys and that she hot-wired it or something…I’d have to double check.

Zodiac could have offered SOMETHING that wasn’t in the paper (like what she was wearing )…but he didn’t.

I believe Kathleen Johns account of what happened to her 100%. I just think she was mistaken when it came to the man being Zodiac.

T., no there would be no reason to relocate her car. That’d be silly. Dead right.

The guy removed two of her lug nuts says WC, well found, and if he took a couple of lug nuts off, loosened the other two, then put the hub cap back on it would mean casual inspection of the wheel wouldn’t reveal his dastardly trick, that’s great. And the wheel wobbled – it would be noisy – so she stopped.

The only thing I don’t like is that when hub caps come off cars it’s got to be like in "Bullitt" where they go ripping on down the road for miles, usually never to be seen again. Not lying around in a field very nearby, being found. That’s a bit weird.

Anyway, whatever it happened, it wasn’t that serial liar (oops!) serial killer "The Zodiac" in the car. Fair enough!

What was she wearing btw? I’m betting on a Carmen Miranda headress and diving boots.

T., no there would be no reason to relocate her car. That’d be silly. Dead right.

The guy removed two of her lug nuts says WC, well found, and if he took a couple of lug nuts off, loosened the other two, then put the hub cap back on it would mean casual inspection of the wheel wouldn’t reveal his dastardly trick, that’s great. And the wheel wobbled – it would be noisy – so she stopped.

The only thing I don’t like is that when hub caps come off cars it’s got to be like in "Bullitt" where they go ripping on down the road for miles, usually never to be seen again. Not lying around in a field very nearby, being found. That’s a bit weird.

Anyway, whatever it happened, it wasn’t that serial liar (oops!) serial killer "The Zodiac" in the car. Fair enough!

What was she wearing btw? I’m betting on a Carmen Miranda headress and diving boots.

I see you’ve edited this post Smithy and removed your comment of "WC, where he got the story of the tow truck driver from I don’t know",or words to that effect. So, especially for you…..