It’s not impossible but I err toward the case never being resolved, too long has passed and evidence preservation wasn’t the best.

Hi guys,

New here, still just getting my head around all the details of this huge case. I did have one question I was interested to hear your opinions on. As amateur investigators or simply Zodiac case enthusiasts , is there only so much we can do here in 2015?

If the real zodiac was never named as a suspect at the time, is it now impossible to find him?

Is there anyway this case could be solved if zodiac was never even a person of interest at the time?

Four ways it can be solved:

1. Physical evidence, such as DNA and fingerprints.

2. A confession/revelation, likely from a friend or family.

3. Blind luck perusing news archives, footage, et cetera.

4. A in-depth review of the investigators’ archives.

I’m pretty sure the police talked to this guy, or took a call from someone who reported him to police. Whether or not the police investigated, and whether or not those records still even exist, is another question altogether.

I lean toward no resolution. I think The Zodiac was someone who wasn’t marked by a documented criminal history, possessed few friends, few acquaintances, little family, and probably passed away within a decade of his crimes. This means he left behind virtually nothing to connect him to the crimes. I also tend to think that he would have ditched any direct evidence connecting himself to the crimes, and no one would be suspicious of paper, pencil, markers and perhaps a ruler.

He was a ghost of fortune, and barring a miracle or a statistically outlying occurrence, what we call blind luck, I wouldn’t bet on him ever being identified.

4. A in-depth review of the investigators’ archives.

I’m pretty sure the police talked to this guy, or took a call from someone who reported him to police. Whether or not the police investigated, and whether or not those records still even exist, is another question altogether.

This is the holy grail, as far as I’m concerned. The SFPD material, not least.

I think it’s likely that Z was indeed looked at, in some shape or form, no matter how briefly. He may have been – as wiser heads than mine have suggested in the past – checked out of the investigation simply because he did not fit the profile at the time.

The big question is whether the records in question – the grail itself – even exist anymore. Not only do we not HAVE the SFPD reports, we don’t even know to what extent they’re extant. It’s frustrating, to say the least.

I read that at one time, many of the envelopes were missing. Turned out a retired investigator took them home and had them in his private collections.

And yet, people are highly skeptical a London policeman took home evidence from the Catherine Eddowes murder…

Anyway, I’m not much into SFPD’s records, but those of VPD.

I’m betting someone reported the man known as The Zodiac and the police either didn’t follow up or they did speak with him but dismissed him for whatever reason.

I’ll bet he’s in there.

just adding my agreement that i think he was reported by someone and his true name exists somewhere in the vpd files. to me san fran and riverside (IF he were involved with bates) are outliers and vallejo is where you’ll find someone who knew him or saw something and reported it. we have dozens of police reports that mention people they checked out or spoke with but i’d really like to see the notes that were passed to the detectives as far as who called stuff in or talked to other cops about potential suspects. he’s in that suspect pool somewhere, they always are, and when he’s found it’ll be a facepalm and an "of course, that guy fit the description perfectly". my 2 cents.

Cary Stayner was interviewed a few times in the deaths of a number of women, but he was "cleared" because he didn’t have a previous criminal record and remained calm during the interviews.

Zodiac likely didn’t have a previous criminal history either, and if he was interviewed, I’d imagine he would have kept calm as well.

If he is in the files, one would want to look for someone similar.

There is an extremely high chance the Zodiac Killer has been on their radar at some point in the investigation, in excess of 2,000 lines were trawled at the time, but short of a fingerprint or DNA match, a resolution remains slim at best. The way evidence was handled back then and the contamination of virtually every crime scene, probably meant the case was scuppered before it had even begun. Short of catching him in the act, which they nearly did, but didn’t or a sample match, may mean running down Home Depot and stocking up on the shovels, because the Zodiac has probably transcended to the afterlife he forever sought and the only evidence match lies six feet down.

Zodiac likely didn’t have a previous criminal history either, and if he was interviewed, I’d imagine he would have kept calm as well.

That is extremely unlikely, most murderers or serial killers usually start offending with much smaller, less serious infractions before the take the plunge into murder, or double murder in the case of Lake Herman Road. He most certainly had previous.

Zodiac likely didn’t have a previous criminal history either, and if he was interviewed, I’d imagine he would have kept calm as well.

That is extremely unlikely, most murderers or serial killers usually start offending with much smaller, less serious infractions before the take the plunge into murder, or double murder in the case of Lake Herman Road. He most certainly had previous.

I never said he had not previously committed a crime. I said he did not have a criminal history, which is generally understood to mean a criminal past that is publicly documented.

I wonder sometimes if we’re close – now – to a point where LE (all jurisdictions) will just release every last scrap of paper relevant to the case.

Some FOIA requests are still turned down based on the case being under investigation, formally speaking, but I can’t help but think that this is just an unnecessary hindrance. I’m NOT one of those people who think the cops are all idiots and that the investigation is, in principle, better left to armchair sleuths and online amateurs – but at this point I really do think that the so-called Zodiac community represents a better de facto resource than a solitary man assigned to a cold case he may or may not be very familiar with and/or interested in.

I agree Norse…wholeheartedly.

I wonder sometimes if we’re close – now – to a point where LE (all jurisdictions) will just release every last scrap of paper relevant to the case.

Some FOIA requests are still turned down based on the case being under investigation, formally speaking, but I can’t help but think that this is just an unnecessary hindrance. I’m NOT one of those people who think the cops are all idiots and that the investigation is, in principle, better left to armchair sleuths and online amateurs – but at this point I really do think that the so-called Zodiac community represents a better de facto resource than a solitary man assigned to a cold case he may or may not be very familiar with and/or interested in.

Dunno about that. FOIAs generally cover only information controlled by the US government. I doubt every page of the police investigation was copied over to the FBI, thus you’d have to file a California FOIA, which doesn’t cover open investigations. Even if the case was closed permanently, it would likely be heavily redacted, which would preclude releasing personally identifiable information.

That’s my understanding.

…thus you’d have to file a California FOIA, which doesn’t cover open investigations.

That’s what I’m talking about.

But LE wouldn’t have to formally close the investigation(s) in order to release more paperwork relevant to the case. They could in theory do the latter as an investigatory measure – which I think they should, because they’re going to need all the help they can get if the case is ever to be solved.

…thus you’d have to file a California FOIA, which doesn’t cover open investigations.

That’s what I’m talking about.

But LE wouldn’t have to formally close the investigation(s) in order to release more paperwork relevant to the case. They could in theory do the latter as an investigatory measure – which I think they should, because they’re going to need all the help they can get if the case is ever to be solved.

I think they have to do more than just close it, because as we saw with SFPD, the respective jurisdictions can reopen the case later. So they’d have to close it for good, and in each and every jurisdiction.

I know VPD hasn’t closed the case, and don’t think they will any time soon. Even then, I think much of the PII would be redacted.

What we could use is a friend in VPD, or someone who retired and knows a lot about what’s in the case files, like alternatives to ALA.