AK Wilks, Subject: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:05 pm
Up until this point, I have thought members of the Ramsey family may have been involved. Perhaps Burke, with Patsy and John covering it up. Perhaps Patsy. Much of the writing on the ransom note has similarities to Patsy’s writing. But just as an intruder may have got the information on the $118,000 bonus from a paycheck stub, an intruder might have copied from writing of Patsy Ramsey, not so much to implicate her, but just to disguise his/her own style. Some experts say Patsy Ramsey likely wrote it, others say she did not. Many experts did say the writing and word choice indicated it was probably done by a middle aged white female. A lot of circumstantial evidence points to the Ramsey’s.
But new DNA evidence appears to clear the Ramsey’s. They now have male DNA from three seperate spots on her body or clothes, and that DNA does NOT match Burke or John Ramsey. One of the DNA spots produced 9 markers, meaning it is highly unlikely to have come from a school playmate or other accidental source. The presence of the DNA in three spots also goes against an accidential source.
About nine months after JonBenet’s death, a dance school classmate of hers named "Amy" was the victim of an attempted abduction. Nachtsider provided this link previously dealing with "Amy" and other evidence of an intruder in the Ramsey case:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/12/ … 1569.shtml
Doug Oswell and myself [AK Wilks] were the sources for the information that led the FBI to recently request a DNA draw on Ted Kaczynski for comparison with possible suspect DNA in the Tylenol Murders case. We are waiting for a court order on the DNA draw and awaiting the outcome of the comparison in that case.
Recently Doug Oswell and I took a fresh look at the Ramsey case, which absent a major lab error, now appears more likely to have been done by an intruder.
We are looking at Brian Mitchell, aka "Brian David Mitchell", aka "Immanuel", aka the kidnapper of Elizabeth Smart, as a possible suspect.
Comments by Doug Oswell
Analysis by AK Wilks
If you look even superficially at the Ramsey and Smart cases you’ll see that they have a great deal in common.
* First, the victims were from two relatively wealthy upper-middle-class families living in large houses where the children’s sleeping quarters were separated by some distance from those of the parents.
* Those dwellings were in upscale residential areas on the outskirts of major metropolitan areas, each within a very short distance of wilderness area marked by mountainous and hilly terrain. The cities in question were approximately 300 miles apart.
* In both cases renovation work had been done on the houses shortly before the respective incidents, each involving workers strange to the family.
In fact, Brian Mitchell had briefly worked at the Smart home doing odd jobs. The Ramseys had recently had construction and home improvement work done. In addition, they had lawn and landscape services. While it is unlikely that the name "Brian Mitchell" appears on any list of employees of these companies that did work at the Ramsey home, many of these types of companies employ temp workers, who they often pay "under the table", thus there would be no records.
* In both cases, an audacious entry was made into the dwelling through a small aperture while the family members slept; in each case the perpetrator was familiar with the layout of the house.
* The victims themselves shared the common attributes of blonde hair, angelic looks, and unique personal talents. Both were abducted directly from their beds.
Both children were beautiful and shared a very similar look. Both were talented performers, JonBenet in beauty paegents and Elizabeth a harp player. Many serial killers and child molestors have a certian look or type of victim they seek. The similarity between JonBenet and Elizabeth is noteworthy.
Above: Elizabeth Smart and JonBenet Ramsey
Below: Elizebeth Smart Short Hair, Picture of JonBenet Ramsey and Photoshop Image of What JonBenet May Have Looked Like Older, Elizabeth Smart Long hair
* Brian Mitchell, Elizabeth Smart’s abductor, had been classified as a pedophile early in life and was known to have sexually abused young children as an adult. He is an accomplished burglar; small, wiry and thus able to insinuate himself into tight places. He is known to have attempted at least two abductions in addition to that of Elizabeth Smart, both of the audacious "in-house" sort where the dwellings were actually occupied at the time of the attempts.
* Before attempting to abduct Elizabeth Smart’s cousin [Olivia Wright] he told Wanda Barzee that he planned the abduction to occur on a holiday because during a holiday the response to the abduction would be slow.
JonBenet Ramsey was killed on a holiday, Christmas night. The July 24th attempted abduction of Elizabeth Smart’s cousin, Olivia Wright, happened on Pioneer’s Day, and official state holiday in Utah, which recognizes the arrival of the Mormon groups in the area. Most govenrment offices and many businesses are closed. Elizabeth Smart was abducted on June 4, not a holiday per se, but a time of celebration with many school graduations, proms and school events. In fact Elizabeth and her parents were at such an event on the night of June 4, meaning both that they were all out of the house and that Elizabeth was visible at the event.
* Early in 1995, Mitchell and Barzee moved to Idaho, where they lived in a trailer on land belonging to Tom and Betty McKnight. At some point later in the year, after staying on the McKnights’ property for about six months, Mitchell decided to sell their possessions and go on a hitchhiking tour with Barzee. Barzee evidently kept a journal about this tour and was questioned about it during testimony given during court proceedings. Prosecutors attempted to elicit details of their itinerary during this tour, but her answers were vague and general, providing information no more exact than that they had ended up in the eastern U.S. before traveling to Florida and then to Los Angeles and Hawaii before returning to Salt Lake City in mid-1997.
* Yet, according to Betty McKnight, upon leaving Idaho, "Brian and Wanda eventually sold their truck and other possessions and left Idaho with very few belongings as they went hitchhiking to Colorado."
See http://www.fox13now.com/news/local/kstu … full.story
Article on Betty McKnight testimony: "They said, ‘We’re just going to go on our own,’ and they walked away," she said. "All they had was whatever was in their backpack. He picked apples off the tree that we had and put them in his pockets and jacket and that was going to be their food for a while."
McKnight said she wondered what would happen to them.
"I said, ‘Where are you going?’ They said, ‘Colorado,’ " she testified.
ADDITIONAL INFORMATION BY AK WILKS
One objection would be that Elizabeth Smart was 14 years old, and JonBenet Ramsey only 6 years old. Despite the similarity in their looks, a reasonable objection might be raised that JonBenet was likely killed by a pedohile, one who is attracted to pre-pubuesent infants and toddlers, while Mitchell would seem to be attacted to young teenage girls who are in or about to start puberty.
But Mitchell’s ex-wife stated that he had molested their daughter between the ages of 18 months and 5 years old, and family members stated Mitchell had earlier exposed himself to a girl who was 3 to 4 years old, thus indicating that he did have a sexual interest in children the age of JonBenet and younger. Numerous psychiatrists testified that Mitchell was in fact a pedophile.
Also, in September 1997, a girl named "Amy" who had been in JonBenet’s dance class was the victim of a home invasion and attempted abduction. Many investigators regarded this as perhaps being done by the same man who had killed JonBenet. "Amy" was 14 years old, the exact same age as Elizabeth Smart at the time of her abduction.
Eliabeth Smart testified that Mitchell told her if she screamed or made noise he would "duct tape my mouth shut."
JonBenet was found with duct tape over her mouth. This duct tape had animal hairs, perhaps from a beaver, indicating it may have been from someone who was living outdoors in nature, as Brian Mitchell was.
Elizabeth’s sister Mary Katherine stated that during the abduction she thought she head Elizabeth ask "why" she was being taken, and that the abductor said "Ransom".
Of course in the JonBenet case a ransom note was left.
So in both cases the prospect of a kidnap and return for ransom is introduced by the attacker, with no real intent of getting a ransom, but instead to either calm the fears of the victim and/or delay notification of authorities.
In 1995 Brian Mitchell and Wanda Barzee leave Idaho and state they are going to "Colorado". With no real documentation as to their exact whereabouts, it seems very possible if not likely that they are in Colorado during the winter of 1996, the time of the JonBenet murder. It also appears that right around the September 1997 time of the failed abduction of JonBenet’s dance school classmate, the 14 year old "Amy", Mitchell and Barzee stop their two years of wanderings and return to Utah.
Is has previously been speculated that the signing of "SBTC" on the JonBenet ransom note may stand for "Saved By The Cross", a Christian expression that may well have appealed to the extremist Mormon/Christian/Esoteric fundamentalist views of Mitchell and Barzee.
The many different handwriting experts who have examined the ransom note often have differing views on aspects of it, but the most consistent opinion in the majority of the expert handwriting analyses I have seen is that the ransom note, judging by both handwriting styles and phrasology, was likely written by a middle aged white female. Wanda Barzee was a middle aged white female. The number of male child sex murderers who have an active female accomplice is extremely small. If the handwriting and word analysis experts are right, it appears that the JonBenet killer likely had such an active female accomplice, which matches Brian Mitchell and Wanda Barzee.
And as noted by Doug Oswell, Barzee gave some very odd testimony concerning her handwriting.
See http://breaking.sltrib.com/mitchell/nov … script.php
Nov 18, 2010 Testimony of Wanda Barzee
Steele: So you sold everything and then did you leave?
Barzee: I think it was Aug. 8 that we were on the property of Fred and Janice Benson and I got a priesthood blessing and I felt that we were given specific instruction on how we were to travel, hitchhiking across the nation to see the sights and early history of the (LDS) church. We were first to stop and Adam-ondi-Ahman (in Missouri) and go from there.
Steele: Is that what you did? Did you write a book about it?
Barzee: I kept a journal.
Steele: What did you call that journal?
Barzee: I can’t remember.
[Steele calls for exhibit. Shows it to Barzee.]
Barzee: I think this is the journal I wrote when we went through the nation.
Steele: If you would look at … first of all … is it typed, handwritten?
Barzee: It’s in my handwriting.
Steele: And your handwriting is special is it not?
Barzee: It was then. I was always right-handed but when we traveled through the nation we were up in the Santa Cruz mountains of Palo Alto, California. We stayed there for five months while we pulled a handcart and I felt impressed to practice writing with my left hand. So this was written with my left hand.
Steele: How long did it take to teach yourself to write left-handed?
Barzee: It took me a while. While Brian said he was ministering, I would be at libraries and I would practice writing recipes and things down.
Steele: If I were to call that calligraphy instead of mere handwriting would that be fair?
(answer not heard)
—– —– —– —–
This testimony is very strange. It has no real relevance to the Smart case – it makes no difference with which hand she wrote the journal. But if we consider Mitchell a suspect for the JonBenet Ramsey case, and Wanda Barzee as a suspect as an accomplice and possible writer of the ransom note, it then becomes extremely relevant. It might appear as if Barzee wrote the journal after the fact, and after the Ramsey case, as a way to distinguish her writing in the journal from the ransom note writing. There is no logical reason an adult person would suddenly change with hand they write with. It makes no sense. Yet if Barzee wrote the ransom note, she would have a very strong incentive to create a fake journal which has entries that put them on a tour of Mormon historical sites placing them elsewhere than Colorado (when in fact they told Betty McKnight that they were they were going to Colorado) and which has handwriting that is very different from her own natural writing.
There are multiple unconfirmed reports that the DNA found on JonBenet is from a Caucasian. There was also a pubic hair recovered of undescribed color, and a photo of a dark hair on JonBenet’s sleeve. Brian Mitchell is Caucasian and has dark hair.
Judging by the suitcase with some of JonBenet’s things in it found by the window, and the ransom note probably designed to cause delay in notifying authorities, the intent may have been to kidnap JonBenet, and her death partially accidential as a result of the deviant sexual game involving the cord around her neck. Elizabeth Smart testified that at first she was also bound by a cord, a cord that would be tied to a tree.
CONCLUSION
Thus there are numerous reasons to consider Brian Mitchell and Wanda Barzee as serious suspects in the JonBenet Ramsey case. Of course, Mitchell was convicted on federal kidnapping charges, and sentenced in May 2011. In theory, there should be a DNA draw done on him, with his DNA placed into CODIS. Newspaper reports indicate that some of the DNA found on JonBenet’s body and underwear had 9 markers, enough to be entered into CODIS. Thus, in theory, at some point CODIS would indicate a "hit" if there is a match between the Mitchell DNA and the Ramsey suspect DNA.
Theory is one thing, reality is another. Red tape and bureacracy might mean that the Mitchell DNA draw and entry into CODIS could take place in a few months, but it could also be a few years. There are 300,000 DNA profiles waiting for inclusion into CODIS. By routine procedure, if and when the Mitchell DNA draw is done, it would go to the back of this line for entry into CODIS. Thus it could be several years before it is actually entered. And if Mitchell refuses to cooperate, there could be more delays of months if not years in getting a court order to get the DNA.
Ted Kaczynski was convicted on federal charges in 1998, yet the FBI is now seeking a court order to get a DNA draw on him, because Ted never had a DNA draw done from his body and his DNA has never been entered into CODIS.
If he has not already been cleared and the authorities think the evidence pointing to Mitchell as a suspect in the JonBenet Ramsey cases merits investigative follow up, then they MUST request Mitchell’s DNA if it is already on record with the FBI and/or Salt Lake City PD, request the federal prison to expedite procedures for the Mitchell DNA draw and inclusion in CODIS or directly request a court to order a DNA draw on Mitchell.
Post from DOUG OSWELL:
AK–Good analysis. There’s one thing that throws cold water on it, though. I happened to find a copy of the handwritten journal that Barzee kept after leaving Idaho, and the entries for Christmas of 1996 show them in Portland, Oregon and preparing for a trip to Alaska, where they supposedly stayed for several weeks. See http://unazod.com/odd/birth_zion.pdf . For my part, I have no trouble believing that Mitchell could have ginned up this journal for no other reason than to provide himself with an alibi. But of course, not everyone is going to see it that way. (The journal isn’t written in diary fashion; the entries appear to have been made after the fact, and the ones covering the time in question are quite vague, particularly as to events.)
I’m not going to get all worked up about this, but I’ll definitely stay alert.
It’s hard to do writing comparisons between the Ramsey ransom note and the calligraphic-style handwriting used by Wanda Barzee in her "Birth of Zion" document. Here are some things, however, that really stand out [as common on both documents]: (1) wordspacing is even throughout; (2) there is double-spacing after a period; (3) the abbreviation "a.m." contains no periods; (4) paragraphs are set off with large indents; and perhaps most interesting of all (5) line spacing is even but tight, with the descenders of one line allowed to run directly into ascenders of the next line.
One particularly noteworthy passage from the Barzee document:
"A significant vision took place 12 January 1999 that I entitled, "Vision of Celebration/Birthday Party – Wedding Feast." The vision was a little girl going to her bedroom to hide behind the headboard of her bed that was covered with stuffed animals so she wouldn’t have to participate in the celebration that was about to take place."
AK Wilks: It appears that the entire Barzee Mitchell journal appears to have been written after the fact, and may be a huge attempt at an alibi. For the rough time period of winter 1996, there is nothing I know of to prove that they actually were in Portland/Seattle and headed to Alaska.
In fact given their finances, it appears very unlikely they went to Alaska, or that they could survive as homeless people there. It does give them an excuse why nobody could place them in Utah. So rather than rely on their vague after the fact journal which may be false, I would place more faith in the statement of a thrid party, the McKnights, who testified that in 1995 Mitchell and Barzee said they were going to COLORADO.
In the journal they state that a homeless man gave them $300 for a ticket to Alaska. They state he had this money from disability checks and wanted to help them. This story sounds very fanciful to me. Homeless men do not typically have $300 handy and do not often give it away to strangers.
It would be interesting to see if any hard evidence places them in Alaska, and if so, was it before or after Christmas 1996.
This I think is the passage mentioned by Doug. Reading this, you can picture JonBenet hiding behind her bed, a bed that I do think had stuffed animals.
I also post the ransom note here. I can’t really see any major similarities in the writing, but the Journal is done in such an odd calligraphy method it is really hard to make any judgements. Doug makes some interesting observations about certain common formatting and style elements.
When you see pictures of the Ramsey house from the front, it looks small. I used to think "How could they not hear the scream that a nieghbor heard?"
But when you see the rear of the Ramsey home, you realize it was huge, a mansion. It is very probable that the Ramseys sleeping on the third floor would not hear anything from the basement, or even JonBenet’s room on the second floor.
And the Ramsey home does look like the Smart home – both are exceptionally large homes. Very similar.
Left: Home of Elizabeth Smart Right: Rear of JonBenet Ramsey Home Bottom: Floor Plan For Basement of Ramsey Home
Two excerpts from the Barzee Mitchell journal. One mentions, in what purports to be around 2001, "failed attempts" to get the first wife, and that they shall take girls "10 to 14" in age. If you go back 4 years, that would indicate a 6 year old to be taken in 1996/1997. But the "failed attempts" may just refer to their efforts to convince adult young women to join them in plural marriage.
The second excerpt refers to the plan to kidnap Smart, wherein Wanda Barzee will offer words to soothe her, and then "bath" her body. The killer(s) of JonBent packed a suitcase with JonBenet’s bedding and her Dr. Seuss book. There is evidence an intruder may have given JonBenet a bit of pinaapple to eat. An effort to "soothe" a little girl and make her feel comfortable enough to leave peacefully? And her vaginal area and other parts of her body were "wiped". An effort to "bath" the girl?
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sat Jul 02, 2011 2:51 pm
AweShucks – I agree what is interesting here is TWO tracks of evidence, one showing brutal disregard for JonBenet and lustful intent, the other showing some degree of caring. Also, a track of evidence showing intent to transport off site. The skull fracture may have been to silence, as may have been too much pressure on the neck rope.
Doug Oswell = "Having found a convenient means of entry he might have spent considerable time alone in the dwelling prior to that date, even on the 25th itself while the Ramseys were away. He might even have been lurking in the house when they arrived home!"
AK = Apparently that is what investigators think probably happened in the 9/14/97 attempted abduction of "Amy", JonBenet’s dance school classmate.
http://www.acandyrose.com/s-september97-intruder.htm
2000-04-04: Webbsleuths Forum ( http://www.webbsleuths.org )
"More on 1997 Boulder intruder"
Posted by MaskedMan on Apr-04-00 at 03:43 PM (EST)
I obtained the Boulder Police report on the intruder who sexually assaulted a girl in her bedroom in the middle of the night while her mother was asleep in the next room. To preserve their privacy, I won’t use their names.
On Sept. 13-14, 1997, an intruder got into a Boulder home occupied by a mother and daugher. The father was out of town when the crime occurred. The girl was 14 years old. There was no sign of a forcible break-in. It’s unclear how the intruder got in, but he may have entered through a back door that was unlocked before the mother went to bed that night.
The intruder apparently snuck in and hid in the house for several hours, waiting until 3:00 a.m. before going to the girl’s bedroom. He wore black clothing, knew the girl’s name and knew his way around the house in the dark. The house had motion detectors and an alarm system which were set at 11:00 p.m., but he didn’t set off the alarm.
AK = The Ramsey attacker, who may or may not be Amy’s attacker, could have done the same thing while the Ramsey’s were at the Christmas Party. Giving him/her plenty of time to write the ransom note, even time to look at Patsy’s writing.
QUESTIONS
1. Does anyone know how tall Brian David Mitchell is? In court pictures he always seems 2 to 3 inches shorter than the deputies. The attacker of Amy was described as about 5′ 7".
2. Has anyone seen the word "HENCE" or "AND, HENCE" in the Barzee Mitchell journal? It appears in the ransom note and the Ramsey’s used it on a card once.
DESCRIPTION OF AMY’S ATTACKER
First, she thought she saw blonde hair from underneath a backwards cap. The blonde hair would rule out BDM, unless he dyed it or was wearing a wig.
Other aspects match him. A black "ninja" out fit sounds similar to clothes he wore.
"The victim ‘did not recognize the voice of the suspect.’ She said the suspect had a "deep voice….his jaw line stood out," his throat was real "thin," and the suspect’s face was "very angular."
The mother described the assailant as about 5 feet 7 inches tall, 20 to 30 years old, with blond hair.
She noted that he had an angular, thin face, with a jaw line that "really stood out."
AK – A sketch was done with input by psychic Dorothy Allison. I don’t know if other sources were used, but the Ramsey family put out the sketch as a "man who may have been in the Boulder area in December 1996." There were numerous burglaries in the usually low crime area. Also, about a dozen different internet posters noted the sketch had many similarities to the descriptions of the attacker in the Amy case – thin, angular face, strong jaw, pointed chin.
I don’t believe in psychics, but this Dorothy Allison said the killer in another case was named "brown" but not spelled like the color. His name was "Browne". I do think some people may have intuitive gifts we don’t fully understand. This one of the few cases of a psychic proving useful, I have read hundreds were they were not. But even if we dismiss her, the Ramsey family investigators may have used other sources for the sketch, and coincidence or not, it appears to be similar to Amy’s attacker, and Boulder Police never bothered to do a sketch, so its all we have.
http://www.acandyrose.com/s-sketchman.htm
August 6, 1995: Colorado Springs Gazette – Tracking Heather’s KILLER:
In 1992, Dorothy Allison, a noted New Jersey psychic who has worked with police across the country, called the Friends of Heather Dawn Church Foundation."
`I can tell you the killer’s name right now,’ "Allison remembered saying. " `His name is Brown.’"But not like the color brown; not spelled that way.
No one is quite sure how the tip was pursued. The name was probably compared with those of everyone connected with the case, Smit said. Then it was forgotten.
"No one got religion. But in November, El Paso County got a new sheriff, John Anderson, a former Colorado Springs police sergeant. Anderson soon hired an old partner, Lou Smit, as head of investigations. Smit, who has a knack for solving old homicide cases, made Heather a top priority again.
Shortly after starting work last January, Smit reviewed Heather’s file, a process he calls "messing with a case." He asked his investigators to come up with something new, something that hadn’t been tried.
Tom Carney, a crime laboratory technician, immediately thought of the prints. "We knew those fingerprints had to be from the suspect," he said.
A better approach, he figured, would be an exhaustive mailing of quality photos of the prints to every police agency with an Automated Fingerprint Identification System. Like the FBI’s system, AFIS compares fingerprint images electronically. AFIS computers aren’t interconnected, but each one may contain prints that aren’t in the hands of the FBI.
So Carney made 100 sets of photos of the three fingerprints and began sending them to 92 agencies with AFIS. Carney remembered thinking, "If this doesn’t work, that’s it.
On March 24, someone from the Louisiana prison system called to report a match between the prints from the Church home and prints in its data base. The prints belonged to Robert Charles Browne. He had spent time in Louisiana prisons for various crimes, including auto theft, in the early and mid-1980s. He moved to Colorado in 1987 and, after living at several addresses, settled into a home just down the road from the Church residence.
"Considering all the publicity, detectives figured they’d hear from psychics. Some detectives scoff at psychics; others are skeptical but willing to listen.
"I’m not going to disregard them," said Capt. Lou Smit, now head of investigations for the Sheriff’s Office. "Sometimes, psychics come up with things you can’t explain. And sometimes they come up with things almost too hard to believe."
April 27, 1998: Dorothy Allison descibed JonBenet’s killer on the Leeza Gibbon’s Show:
"He’s probably 5’7" to 5’9". He’s got thin, brown hair that he wears over to the side, perhaps a little bit balding underneath. He has a very wide cranium on top and a real small chin, very thin lips and a pointed nose, very light eyes — kind of Germanic descent, and a very slender build throughout the body, a little bit wide through the hips, high pitched voice and soft spoken."
Amy’s attacker described as: "She noted that he had an angular, thin face, with a jaw line that ‘really stood out.’ "
http://dallasnews.com/national/129104_ramsey_01nat.html
08/01/2000
Police chief doubts same person killed Ramsey, attacked teen girl
By Charlie Brennan / Special Contributor to The Dallas Morning News
BOULDER, Colo. – Nine months after the slaying of JonBenet Ramsey, a girl who attended the same dance studio as the young beauty queen and lived just two miles away was assaulted in her bed by an intruder while her mother slept nearby.
That crime, detailed in Boulder police reports, has common threads with the Ramseys’ theory that their 6-year-old daughter was attacked by someone who hid in their home on Christmas night 1996.
Key players in the Ramsey drama – including the prosecutors who led a fruitless grand jury probe into JonBenet’s slaying – learned of the September 1997 incident only last week.
Police Chief Mark Beckner said he doesn’t see strong similarities between the cases, primarily because JonBenet was killed while the other girl, a 14-year-old, escaped serious injury. But last week, he ordered comparisons of partial palm prints found at both scenes.
Chief Beckner said the prints appear to be from different parts of the hand, but he assigned a detective to re-examine that issue "to see if there is something there that we missed." He said he did not know when the results would be available.
The Ramseys, who plan to meet with Boulder police late this month, were told about the second case on Monday. Police said they consider the couple suspects in their daughter’s slaying. The Ramseys maintain that they are innocent.
"The fact than an assault was made in a home of a young girl in Boulder within nine months of JonBenet’s assault is hugely significant," Mr. Ramsey said. "Fortunately, there are not that many creatures like this out there, so this is very significant."
He said he was eager to learn more details about the other assault.
The Ramseys’ attorney, Lin Wood, and investigators who reviewed the police reports last week, said the assault on the 14-year-old and the Ramseys’ version of JonBenet’s final night have similar elements.
Mr. Ramsey confirmed Monday that JonBenet took lessons at Dance West, a studio where the second victim had performed. The studio owner, Lee Klinger, said he has never been contacted by police investigating either case.
Both girls performed at public functions in Boulder not long before being victimized: The 14-year-old girl danced in several public performances in the year before her assault. JonBenet, the reigning Little Miss Christmas, was featured in a holiday parade shortly before she was killed.
Investigators surprised
Investigators who worked on the Ramsey case for Boulder District Attorney Alex Hunter said they were surprised last week to learn about the second attack.
"I’m shocked," said Steve Ainsworth, a Boulder County sheriff’s detective who spent a year as a consultant on the case to Mr. Hunter. "I think this is something that definitely should have been brought up. I was pretty amazed at the similarities."
According to Boulder police reports, there was no sign of forced entry in either incident. The 14-year-old’s attacker knew her by name, while a ransom note in the Ramsey case suggested JonBenet’s killer somehow knew her family. And in both cases, the sexual assault was penetration by a finger or an object, police reports said.
Mr. Ainsworth, who has never ruled out an intruder in the Ramsey slaying, said the second case shows that the Ramseys’ theory is plausible.
"One of the things that people are saying is, ‘Well, what did the guy do? Go in there and hide for a couple of hours until they came home?’ Like, as if that’s something that would never happen, that it’s so stupid, no one would ever consider it," Mr. Ainsworth said. "Well, that’s what happened in this case."
AK – Also, male DNA perhaps from saliva was found in a blood drop on JonBenet’s panties, perhaps indicating the attacker placed his mouth on or near her vagina. Amy’s attacker did put his mouth on her vagina.
morf13, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sat Jul 02, 2011 3:44 pm
I dont know alot about the Ramsey case, but I just watched a documentary with Aphrodite Jones the other day,and there was a private investigator on that said they actually found an odd type of boot print on the basement floor (they named the brand&model, but I forget what it was called). A suspect in the case killed himself at some point after the crime, and when they went to look thru his stuff, they found that he owned an identical boot to the one found at the crime scene. Also interesting was that in the days leading up to xmas, the Ramseys had a big open house tour of their home, and hundreds of people, many strangers came thru the home.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Jul 03, 2011 1:09 pm
Yes many strangers came through on that tour, they also had workers on the home for remodeling.
Amy was the dance school classmate of JonBenet’s who was attacked on 9/14/97. The Mitchell Barzee journal indicates they returned to Utah on 9/21/97.
DESCRIPTION OF AMY’S ATTACKER
First, she thought she saw blonde hair from underneath a backwards cap. The blonde hair would rule out BDM, unless he dyed it or was wearing a wig.
Other aspects match him. A black "ninja" out fit sounds similar to robe clothes he wore.
"The victim ‘did not recognize the voice of the suspect.’ She said the suspect had a "deep voice….his jaw line stood out," his throat was real "thin," and the suspect’s face was "very angular."
The mother described the assailant as about 5 feet 7 inches tall, 20 to 30 years old, with blond hair.
She noted that he had an angular, thin face, with a jaw line that "really stood out."
In pictures Brian David Mitchell, here on the far left, appears 2 to 3 inches shorter than other men. It appears he may be about 5′ 7" tall.
Little Amy said the attacker ‘had a voice like an older man but looked like a young man’. I wonder if in the dark, BDM’s 5’7" very thin body looked like a "young man" to her, but he had the voice of a man in his 40’s (which BDM was).
, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Jul 03, 2011 1:12 pm
AK this is amazing work. You and Doug have done an excellent job.
morf13, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:10 pm
I know the guy John Karr that made the false confession about killing Ramsey was apparently cleared in the Ramsey case, but he looks a hell of alot like the sketch of the attacker in the other case:
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:08 am
Found this on page 9 of the Barzee Mitchell journal. The ransom note also starts a sentence by using "At this time" and there is also use of an editors caret.
Some people found it suspect that the Ramseys used the very dated and odd word "hence" in a card. The ransom note uses "hence".
Doug Oswell notes that there is one use of the word "hence" in Brian David Mitchell’s own "Book of Immanuel."
Some percentage of the population, probably fairly large, uses editors carets. Some percentage starts sentences by saying "At this time" or "At the time". And some percentage of the population, probably pretty small, uses the very dated and odd word hence. Presumably, a fairly small percentage of the population would do all three.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:40 pm
Bingo! Found by Zodiac researcher Kite.
Page 43 of the Barzee Mitchell Journal
"Hence" is a very old word usage and fairly rare. Some police detectives thought it very significant that the Ramseys (who are Christian) used the word in a card, as it is used in the ransom note. And here we have both Barzee useing it in the Journal and Doug Oswell reporting its use in Mitchell’s own book.
I find it more and more significant that they mention prior "failed attempts" at attaining a "wife."
In the journal I think every major encounter they have with a person that person is described with both first and last names. Did they support themselves with burglaries, or other illegal activities? Or did "a homeless blackman named Phil" [no last name given] really walk up and hand them $300, making it possible for them to go to Alaska at about the time of the JonBenet murder?
Also note for most if not every Christmas they describe exactly where they were and what they did, but not for Xmas 1996.
The question was asked "why didn’t he at least remove her from the home to stall for time"
From what I understand, he did not own a car. When he took Elizabeth he walked with her several miles to his camp. If JonBenet was non-compliant, he may well have thought carrying a struggling little girl through the streets would attract notice.
Mitchell did night time home invasion abductions of girls from their beds, in large homes in nice areas, and came equipped with duct tape for the mouth and rope cords for arms and legs.
He had a knife against the THROAT of Elizabeth. Had she moved an inch, her throat would have been cut.
JonBenet had a rope loop around her THROAT.
Setting aside the unproven chloroform aspect, the prosecutions theory in the Anthony case is that she was killed by duct tape over the mouth and nose suffocating her. Elizabeth testified Mitchell told her is she made noise he would "DUCT TAPE MY MOUTH SHUT."
As it was removed by John, we don’t know for sure if the DUCT TAPE OVER THE MOUTH OF JONBENET WAS ALSO OVER HER NOSE.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Wed Jul 06, 2011 8:01 pm
Consider this. Mrs. McKnight testified under oath that Mitchell-Barzee said they were going to "Colorado". I have no reason to doubt her and I believe it to be true.
Mitchell and Barzee went to Colorado in late 1995, and may have been there in Winter of 1996.
Why then in their journal, do Mitchell – Barzee never mention going to Colorado?
Why lie about it?
In a journal in which every other person is identified by a first and last name, why do they make the improbable claim that a "homeless blackman named Phil" gave them $300 to go to Alaska? Their apparent alibi for Christmas 1996 is a homeless man named "Phil" just gave them $300 and they went to Alaska.
Sorry, I don’t buy it!
And I find it odd that they deny going to Colorado and offer this nonsense in exchange.
Also, this is the article that appeared in the local paper just days before the JonBenet aborted kidnapping/murder. It mentions a "billion dollars" in sales. It references the prior Southern location of the company (Georgia), as no doubt papers in the house would, thus leading someone with only this knowledge to advise John Ramsey to use his "southern common sense", when in fact he is from Michigan.
Elizabeth Smart said that Mitchell would go to libraries prior to attempted kidnappings, he said to look at "maps". Might he also have looked at newspapers, at the library or elsewhere, to identify potential targets? Or is the newspaper article just a coincidence?
If John and/or Patsy Ramsey threw in the $118,000 bonus as the ransom demand to make it look like an angry current or ex employee did it, why would they throw in the "southern common sense" comment, since certainly current or former employees would know that John was not from the South, did not have a Southern accent and in fact was from Michigan?
http://web.dailycamera.com/extra/ramsey … /21-1.html
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Thu Jul 07, 2011 4:48 pm
COMPARISON OF WORDS AND STYLES IN JONBENET RAMSEY RANSOM NOTE AND THE JOURNAL OF CHILD KINDNAPPERS BARZEE AND MITCHELL
Common words and styles in both the ransom note and the Barzee Mitchell Journal include:
"Hence"
"Individual’s"
"We Represent"
"At this time/At the time"
Use of an editors caret
"am" without periods
"Possession"
"Instructions"
"Adequate"
"Particularly"
"southern" Not Capitalized
And others as well
Also found this on page 9 of the Barzee Mitchell journal. The ransom note also starts a sentence by using "At this time" and there is also use of an editors caret.
When we speak of the "South" as a distinct region of the country it is proper to capitalize it. "Southern Rock", "Southern cooking", etc. Thus I do find it interesting that both the ransom writer and journal writer do not capitalize "southern".
Both ransom writer and journal writer make the unneeded designation that a group consists of "individuals". Ransom note writer says we are a "group of individuals." Several writers commented on how this was odd – as opposed to a group of what, plants? All that was needed to say was "we are a group representing a small foreign faction". Similarly, the Mitchell Barzee Journal says "On occasion transported by individuals using their truck or trailer." Again, all that was needed was to say "transported by motorists using truck or trailer" or "transported by drivers". Not needed is the designation that the drivers are "individuals", as they are not going to be animals. Also, "persons" or "people" are more common that "individuals". And both ransom nore writer and journal writer include an unneeded and improper apostophre so that it appears as "individual’s".
In the context of messages from God, people usually speak of "commands", "commandments", "messages" or "orders". The journal writer speaks of "instructions". Similarly, in the context of a kidnapping ransom note, we usually see "demands", or sometimes "orders, but here we see "instructions".
"Hence" is a very old and seldom used term, used by both the ransom note writer and the journal writer.
The ransom note speaks of the wealthy John Ramsey as a "fat cat". The journal writer speaks of their mission to the poor and homeless, how they travel in areas that are "wealthy, upper class" (p. 10) and "high class neighborhood" (p. 24-25), that the rich value money over God, and that they must rescue by force their "sister wives" out of "Babylon".
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sat Jul 09, 2011 11:54 pm
A 1996 Holiday Barbie doll on the basement floor near JonBenet’s body? No record of anyone in the family giving this as a gift? Brought by the killer as a lure, a way to comfort and soothe JonBenet?
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Jul 11, 2011 4:46 pm
COMPARISON OF WORDS AND STYLES IN JONBENET RAMSEY RANSOM NOTE AND THE JOURNAL OF CHILD KINDNAPPERS BARZEE AND MITCHELL
By AK Wilks, Douglas Oswell and Zander Kite
Common words and styles in both the ransom note and the Barzee Mitchell Journal include:
"Hence"
"Individual’s"
"We Represent"
"At this time/At the time"
Use of an editors caret
"am" without periods and not capitalized
"Possession"
"Instructions"
"Adequate"
"Particularly"
"Being"
"Difficult"
"southern" not capitalized
And others as well
Also found this on page 9 of the Barzee Mitchell journal. The ransom note also starts a sentence by using "At this time" and there is also use of an editors caret.
When we speak of the "South" as a distinct region of the country it is generally proper to capitalize it. "Southern Rock", "Southern cooking", etc. Thus I do find it interesting that both the ransom writer and journal writer do not capitalize "southern".
Both ransom writer and journal writer make the unneeded designation that a group consists of "individuals". Ransom note writer says we are a "group of individuals." Several writers commented on how this was odd – as opposed to a group of what, plants? All that was needed to say was "we are a group representing a small foreign faction". Similarly, the Mitchell Barzee Journal says "On occasion transported by individuals using their truck or trailer." Again, all that was needed was to say "transported by motorists using truck or trailer" or "transported by drivers". Not needed is the designation that the drivers are "individuals", as they are not going to be animals. Also, "persons" or "people" are more common that "individuals". And both ransom nore writer and journal writer include an unneeded and improper apostophre so that it appears as "individual’s".
In the context of messages from God, people usually speak of "commands", "commandments", "messages" or "orders". The journal writer speaks of "instructions". Similarly, in the context of a kidnapping ransom note, we usually see "demands", or sometimes "orders, but here we see "instructions".
"Hence" is a very old and seldom used term, used by both the ransom note writer and the journal writer.
In the journal, the word DIFFICULT is used, apparently referring to kidnapping wives. Here it is on page 35: (….when we will obtain our wives, the first wife being the most DIFFICULT. In succession of taking one young woman at a time, between 10 and 14 years of age, though each experience will seemingly become easier, in all reality, each wife will be as DIFFICULT as the first but for which we will have become stronger…) The ransom note writer says: You are not the only fat cat around so don’t think that killing will be DIFFICULT.
The journal seems to use BEING a lot. It’s almost like a style of writing. The use of the word BEING almost seems awkward and not needed at times. Here are 2 examples from the journal: (I reflected upon my righteous desire of BEING cleansed and healed…) Bottom Page 10. (…but telling him of our BEING directed by the Lord to go to Alaska..)Page 16. The writer from the ransom note says: Speaking to anyone about your situation, such as Police, F.B.I., etc., will result in your daughter BEING beheaded.
The ransom note speaks of the wealthy John Ramsey as a "fat cat". The journal writer speaks of their mission to the poor and homeless, how they travel in areas that are "wealthy, upper class" (p. 10) and "high class neighborhood" (p. 24-25), that the rich value money over God, and that they must rescue by force their "sister wives", the "daughters of God", out of "Babylon".
Stylistics of both Barzee Mitchell Journal and JonBenet Ramsey Ransom Note:
(1) wordspacing is even throughout
(2) there is double-spacing after a period
(3) the abbreviation "a.m." contains no periods
(4) paragraphs are set off with large indents
(5) line spacing is even but tight, with the descenders of one line allowed to run directly into ascenders of the next line.
PS: I know this point is hotly debated, if a stun gun might have been used on JonBenet, with both sides presenting evidence for and against. Elizabeth Smart’s sister says that the man who took her had a "gun", and when her parents were looking for Elizabeth she again said they won’t find her because a "man with a gun" took her. From all available information, testimony and evidence, Brian David Mitchell did not own a firearm. Could he have had a stun gun? Some models like this "Air Taser" would indeed look like a "gun" to a child in the dark.
Kidnap victim Jaycee Dugard tells of a stun gun being used on her to control and subdue her, also causing her to urinate. I mention this in regards to the urine stains found on JonBenet’s clothes, though she did have a problem with bedwetting, could this be a possible explanation to both the urine stains and the two marks that Detective Lou Smit thought were from a stun gun?
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Tue Jul 12, 2011 4:59 pm
Above is a letter from Brian David Mitchell. Most of it is in cursive and can’t be compared to the ransom note. The "M" is not in cursive and you can compare it to the "M" in the ransom note.
Also, it was written 19 years before the ransom note.
But below is the "M" from BDM’s letter, I eliminated the curly, and next to it is the "M" from the ransom note. They appear to be close in style, slant and the extra flourish at the end which comes down and then up.
BDM and the ransom note writer also use and spell "POSSESION" with 3 "S" ‘s, though they leave out a different "S".
BDM and the ransom note writer also use "DIFFICULT" and the word "DEVIATE" to indicate variance.
Dreamnine, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Thu Jul 14, 2011 5:49 pm
Very interesting work, AK – I’d never been able to make my mind up about this case, whether it was the family or someone else, it all seemed so inconclusive.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Thu Jul 14, 2011 6:11 pm
I asked Boulder PD if Brian David Mitchell has already been cleared as a suspect in the JonBenet Ramsey case. They stated it is an open investigation and they cannot give out any information at all. I explained who I was, and that Doug Oswell and I were the source of the information that led the FBI to seek the DNA of Ted Kaczynski in the Tylenol Murders case, and that just because Mitchell was convicted it does not mean his DNA would be quickly put into CODIS, as there was a 300,000 person backlog, and it could be years before his DNA was entered.
I asked them if they were interested in the information about Brian David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee developed by Doug Oswell, Zander Kite and AK Wilks, and they said "Yes", so I sent it to them. From that I draw a reasonable inference that BDN and WB have NOT been cleared as of yet. So they have it, what they do now is up to them. They were very polite and very interested, and it was sent to a person who is in a key position.
MODERATOR
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Fri Jul 15, 2011 5:06 pm
Mitchell and Barzee were both sick sadistic people.
Newspaper Article
Testimony: Mitchell a longtime pedophile
By stephen hunt
The Salt Lake Tribune
First published Dec 03 2010 08:08PM
Updated Mar 23, 2011 12:22AM
Jurors heard evidence Friday that Brian David Mitchell — on trial for kidnapping and sexually assaulting the then-14-year-old Elizabeth Smart in 2002 — is a longtime pedophile with a history of using religion to justify his crimes.
LouRee Gayler testified she was between 12 and 14 years old when Mitchell, her stepfather, would show her pictures of nude women while they prayed alongside her mother, Wanda Barzee.
“I’d open, and then close, my eyes,” said Gayler, who testified Mitchell would lay the pictures on the bed, then nudge her to make her look. “I felt it was wrong.”
And when Mitchell came to her room to say good night, Gayler said, “He’d caress me way too much. His hugs were too long. He’d brush up against my breasts.” At other times he would kiss her on the lips, despite her requests to stop, or thrust his pelvis at her.
Mitchell and Barzee took no pains to hide their sexual relations from Gayler, and Barzee often discussed her sex life with the girl.
“Religion was used as an excuse for their behavior,” Gayler said. “They could treat anybody anyway they wanted and repent so they didn’t have to answer to their wrong doings.”
Gayler, now in her 30s, also provided testimony supporting the prosecution claim that Mitchell is a master manipulator — not an insane religious zealot as his defense asserts.
“He’d play games … with the people closest to him — mind games to get more dominance,” Gayler testified. “Power was important to Brian. He could never get enough.”
[Edited – Mitchell got mad after watching a scene in the movie GOONIES the kids were watching on TV]
Soon after, her parents served Gayler her beloved pet rabbit, Peaches, for dinner, after telling her it was chicken. She found out she had eaten her pet when she couldn’t find Peaches the next morning.
“Wanda started laughing hysterically and said that I ate her for dinner,” Gayler said, adding that Mitchell was in a nearby room “watching with glee.”
TESTIMONY OF ELIZABETH SMART
Viti: On July 23 what occurred?
Smart: He prepared to go down to Salt Lake and go and kidnap my cousin.
Viti: in the general vicinity, where did your cousin live at that time?
Smart: She lived very, very close to the mouth of Big Cottonwood Canyon.
Viti: What preparations did you observe him making before he left that day?
Smart: I was watching him pack the green bags that he had used when he had kidnapped me.
Viti: What did you see him pack into the green bags?
Smart: I saw him pack into the green bags some … a change of clothing, different from his robes. I saw him pack duct tape. I saw him pack a knife. I saw him pack … I recall him packing some food and water.
Viti: Ms. Smart, can you describe the duct tape that you saw him put in the bag?
Smart: It was on a cardboard cylinder like the kind in the middle of a roll of toilet paper and he wrapped it around it.
Viti: Why?
Smart: He said it was to save on weight and room.
[AK = JonBenet had duct tape on her mouth, and Elizabeth also testified that Mitchell told her if she made noise he would "duct tape my mouth shut."]
Viti: Look at government Exhibit 35. Do you recognize it?
Smart: Yes. It’s duct tape around a cardboard cylinder.
Viti: Does that look like the duct tape he wrapped around the cardboard cylinder on July 23?
Smart: Yes.
Viti: May we publish it?
Judge Kimball: You may.
Viti: Ms. Smart, can you describe the clothing you saw him pack in the backpack?
Smart: It was dark clothing, the same he used to kidnap me in, a stocking cap, dark shirt, dark sweats.
[AK = The attacker of JonBenet’s dance school classmate "Amy" also wore dark clothes and a cap, and dark fibers were found on JonBenet near her vagina and on her thighs. The attack on "Amy" happened 9/14/97; Mitchell and Barzee record returning to Utah on 9/21/97.]
Viti: What did he tell you?
Smart: He said he had snuck around the back. There was a window that was slightly open, he pulled it and opened it a little bit more.
There was a screen and he cut the screen. On the other side of the screen there were blinds that were down. He started to push the blinds so he could get in the room and on the window sill on the other sides of the blinds, there were small figurines or books. There were small objects on the other side of he blinds, so when he pushed, they fell off and that scared him so he stopped for a moment, but when he heard nothing, he thought all the objects had fallen already so he pushed again and a lot of objects had fallen off and he heard someone running down the hallway and the lights had come on and a voice yelled “Jessica.”
Viti: What did he do at that time?
Smart: He said he had already started running away from that house.
Viti: When he returned on the 24th, what was he wearing?
Smart: Um, he was wearing the dark clothing.
Viti: What was he wearing on his feet?
Smart: Hiking boots.
[AK = Sole prints from a Hi Tec hiking boot were found in the Ramsey basement.]
Viti: Did he tell you how he was able to reach the window at the Wrights’ home?
Smart: He said he had taken a chair and put it up against the outside of the home.
[AK = A suitcase, with JonBenet’s bedding and a Dr. Suess book, was found under the basement window. Detective Lou Smit thought an intruder had put it there to exit through the window. This shows that both BDM and a possible intruder at the Ramsey home used found objects to boost entry/exit through an unlocked window. It also IMO shows a possible intent to transport the child.]
Viti: Please put up government exhibit 16. Do you recognize it?
Smart: Yes.
Viti: What do you recognize it to be?
Smart: A picture of the outside of our kitchen window with a chair up alongside it.
Viti: In June 2002, was that where it was placed usually?
Smart: No.
Viti: Where did that chair belong?
Smart: Just above, as you walk out the kitchen door, there’s a smaller patio, and the chair belongs up on the patio.
Viti: Thank you. Ms. Smart, I’d like to turn your attention to on or about … withdrawn. Did he ever give you a reason why he chose the 23rd and 24th to kidnap Olivia?
Smart: He talked about the 24th because it was a holiday and he talked about it just being a holiday. They would be not as quick to respond.
Viti: I’m sorry, who wouldn’t be?
Smart: The public.
[AK = I wonder if BDM meant the "police", or the public in general. As Doug Oswell noted, JonBenet was killed on a holiday, Christmas night. Also, it appears that Mitchell may have attempted another home invasion abduction of a child from her bed on or about Christmas. He met California Mormon Church official Virl Kemp on December 8th, and Smart testified it was about two weeks later when he tried to abduct her, and it was two tries over a few days, putting the time period at December 22cd to 26th.]
Viti: What holiday is that, for those who might not know?
Smart: It’s the 24th of July. It’s a Utah holiday, Pioneer Day.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Tue Jul 26, 2011 7:38 pm
TESTIMONY OF ELIZABETH SMART
Viti: Thank you. Ms. Smart, I’d like to turn your attention to on or about … withdrawn. Did he ever give you a reason why he chose the 23rd and 24th to kidnap Olivia?
Smart: He talked about the 24th because it was a holiday and he talked about it just being a holiday. They would be not as quick to respond.
Viti: I’m sorry, who wouldn’t be?
Smart: The public.
[AK = I wonder if BDM meant the "police", or the public in general. As Doug Oswell noted, JonBenet was killed on a holiday, Christmas night. Also, it appears that Mitchell may have attempted another home invasion abduction of a child from her bed on or about Christmas. He met California Mormon Church official Virl Kemp on December 8th, and Smart testified it was about two weeks later when he tried to abduct her, and it was two tries over a few days, putting the time period at December 22cd to 26th.]
Viti: What holiday is that, for those who might not know?
Smart: It’s the 24th of July. It’s a Utah holiday, Pioneer Day.
—– —– —–
BDM and the ransom note writer also use and spell "POSSESION" with 3 "S" ‘s, though they leave out a different "S".
BDM and the ransom note writer also use "DIFFICULT", and the word "DEVIATE" to indicate a variance from a plan or idea.
BDM/WB also using words like ADEQUATE, POSSESSIONS, PARTICULARLY, INDIVIDUALS, BEING, INSTRUCTIONS, "am", "southern", DEVIATE, WE REPRESENT, and HENCE, just to name some that also appear in the ransom note.
Barzee Mitchell Journal
"FOR my BURIAL" p. 30; "YE STAND" p. 32; "IN ANY WAY" p. 18; "AS WELL AS" p. 35.
JonBenet Ransom Note
"FOR proper BURIAL" —– "YOU STAND" —"IN ANY WAY" —— "AS WELL AS".
DOUG OSWELL noted the following:
I found a website that contains quite a few exhibits from the Mitchell trial, including samples of Mitchell’s writing (still cursive, unfortunately) and transcripts of his first police interrogation:
http://breaking.sltrib.com/mitchell/exhibitslinks.php
A few observations:
(1) As AK pointed out earlier, Mitchell’s capital M looks amazingly like the one on the Ramsey "ransom" note. I’m looking at the M in the "letter to Julie" at the site above.
(2) The spacing qualities on all the Mitchell samples are similar if not identical to those on the Ransom note, particularly the running-in of descenders to the line below.
(3) In the interrogation, Mitchell says (part 1, page 5): "You have in your possession The Book of Immanuel
David Isaiah."
(4) In part 1, numerous places, he speaks of having Elizabeth Smart "delivered" to him.
(5) In part 1, page 12, he writes: "Not all laws are righteous, and not all laws come from God. And the Constitution of the United States was founded on righteous principles, and when you read The Book of Immanuel David Isaiah, you’ll come to understand that this nation has become the most corrupt and evil nation on the face of the earth." I’m thinking of this in reference to the line from the ransom note which reads "We respect your bussiness but not the country that it serves."
(6) When Mitchell strikes out a word he does it with several circular scribbles, as in the ransom note.
(7) He begins the "Book of Immanuel" with the single word "Hearken!" This word, for all intents and purposes, is exactly the same in meaning as "Listen carefully!"
As a general observation based on the interrogation, Mitchell is truly a crafty and cautious criminal. Nothing was going to save him in this case, but he handled himself, I think, only slightly worse than if he had shut up and said nothing at all.
AK WILKS: These are the images referenced by Doug Oswell.
Both the Ransom Note Writer and Brian David Mitchell strike out words by making circular loops.
And both the Ransom Note Writer and Brian David Mitchell do capital "M" ‘s in a similar way, with near identical finishing flourishes that come down like a ski slope and become nearly flat.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:02 pm
One thing I found out, the official Mormon Church does not use a cross as a symbol! Thus on the one hand that might make it less likely an ostensible Mormon would use a sign off of "SBTC" if that meant to convey its most common general usage, "Saved By The Cross". On the other hand, a Mormon looking to blame a regular Christian, like John or Patsy Ramsey, may have used it for that deceptive reason. Also, Brian David Mitchell regarded the regular Mormon Church as "apostate" and had gone back to a weird mix of Joseph Smith era original Mormonism, non-Mormon Christian Fundamentalism, New Age strangeness and a pro-poverty anti-rich worldview. So he might well have used "SBTC" as "Saved By The Cross" for either reason.
He also wrote he got a message from God to get seven brides. "Seven Brides To Come"?
Ultimately we can’t really solve that. Reminds me of Dr. Strangelove, the mad general used a recall code of OPE or POE based on Purity Of Essence and Peace On Earth. There could a hundred explanations for SBTC.
The book by former FBI Special Agent and serial killer profiler John Douglas called "The Cases That Haunt Us" has a good chapter on the JonBenet case. He thinks it unlikely the parents did it, and lists evidence in favor of an intruder theory. Also has a chapter on Zodiac.
This was an interesting discussion I had on websleuths, where the overwhelming majority think one or more members of the Ramsey family killed JonBenet:
Originally Posted by vlpate
There has already been a court order to draw BDM’s DNA, you must know that. It only stands to reason he has been put into CODIS – unless you have a documented source that says otherwise.
http://www.ksl.com/?sid=15696692
It is the judgment of the court that Brian David Mitchell, be placed in the custody for life. The defendant shall submit a DNA sample to the Bureau of Prisons. The defendant committed offenses and shall report addresses he resided and register as a sex offender in any state.
AK Wilks:
1. I asked Boulder PD if Brian David Mitchell was cleared as a suspect in the JonBenet Ramsey case, by DNA or other means. While they have issued clearances for John and Burke Ramsey, and indicated that registered sex offenders in the neighborhood did not match the possible suspect DNA, they would not answer my question. They did tell me to send the information and evidence developed by myself, Doug Oswell and Zander Kite about Brian David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee as suspects in the JonBenet Ramsey case. From that I drew a reasonable inference that BDM has not yet been cleared.
2. The sentence and DNA order for Mitchell was entered on May 25, 2011. I believe it is being appealed. That would tend to support what I have said, which is that prior to this sentence date, their was no legal authority to compel a DNA draw from Mitchell. BDM might refuse any DNA extraction until the appeal is over, and even then may physically refuse. (NOTE: In fact, BDM let the regular deadline for appeal lapse without filing. That is strange, for while he had no appeal on facts, he had an excellent novel issue of a federal court declaring him competent to stand trial while a state court said he was not competent).
3. In any event, the current backlog of DNA profiles awaiting entry into CODIS is about 300,000. Absent a special request from the Boulder PD, CBI or FBI, Mitchell would by routine procedure go to the back of this line, meaning actual entry could take place in two to four years, or longer.
See http://www.capemaycountyherald.com/arti … na-backlog
http://www.fbi.gov/news/testimony/fbi-e … na-backlog
http://www.forensicfocusmag.com/articles/3b1cover.html
"One of the most substantial issues facing the criminal justice and forensic community is the backlog of unanalyzed DNA samples and biological evidence from crime scenes. According to the National Institute of Justice (NIJ), the current backlog of samples from rape and homicide cases is 350,000. NIJ estimates of the backlog of convicted offender samples is between 200,000 and 300,000, as well as between 500,000 and 1 million samples that are required under law but not yet collected (23 states require all convicted felons to provide DNA samples). "
4. Ted Kaczynski was arrested in 1996 and was convicted in 1998. He has, as of todays date July 28 2011, still not had DNA extracted from his body or put into CODIS. In May 2011 the FBI stated they would seek a court order to get the DNA of Kaczynski.
5. I have given the information and evidence on BDM and Wanda Barzee as suspects in the JonBenet Ramsey case to Boulder PD in the hope that if they find it interesting they will seek to expediate the inclusion of Mitchell’s and Barzee’s DNA into CODIS or obtain it on their own for comparison, as well as make comparisons of fingerprints, fibers, bootprints, handwriting and word usage. That way we could know if BDM and WB were involved now, instead of maybe finding out in 2, or 3, or 4 years, or maybe never.
——— ——— ———
Quote:
Originally Posted by vlpate
No one snatched her. The ransom note was over-kill. Why would a kidnapper kill JonBenet and then leave evidence of his/her handwriting behind? Especially since he/she left not one other piece of evidence.
AK Wilks:
See http://jonbenetramsey.pbworks.com/w/pag … s%20RN%27s
Similarities to Ramsey Case
•Child Killed Despite Ransom Demand. These include Bobby Franks (age 14), Marian Parker (age 12), the Lindbergh baby (age 20 months), Susan Degnan (age 6), Peter Weinberger (age 33 days) and apparently Clark Handa (age 3).
•No Effort to Collect Ransom Demanded. These include Peter Weinberger (though failure to collect ransom amount left as instructed may have been due to incompetence of kidnapper) and Clark Handa.
•Ransom Note "Bogus." Several of these "kidnappings" entail ransom notes that were "bogus" in the sense that the note was written with the intent to throw off law enforcement or the "kidnapper" knew the victim already was dead and could not be returned alive even had a ransom been paid (which, in some cases, it was). These include Bobby Franks (ransom paid), Marian Parker (ransom paid), the Lindbergh baby (ransom paid), Susan Degnan (body discovered before ransom paid), Peter Weinberger (ransom payment attempted), Gail Jackson (no ransom paid) and Clark Handa (no effort to collect ransom).
Bobby Franks (1924)
•Case Details. This is the infamous Leopold and Loeb case, involving a college student and law student who kidnapped and murdered Bobby Franks in the course of committing the "perfect crime." During the course of trying to pay the ransom amount, the boy’s father learned his son had been found dead. See details at Court TV Crime Library.
•Side-by-Side Comparison to Ramsey Note. A "side-by-side" comparison of the RN to the note used by Leopold and Loeb in the kidnapping and murder of 14-year old Bobby Franks is at Webbsleuths.
Marian Parker (1927)
•Case Details. Marian, age 12, "was snatched in 1927 by someone who sent ransom notes to the family. But kidnapping wasn’t the motive; the "kidnapper" collected a ransom and delivered the girl back to her family — she had been killed and her body desecrated in a classic case of Lustmord or lust murder. See an excellent summary by Mark Gribben." Source: Laura James at Clews The Historic True Crime Blog.
Lindbergh Baby (1932)
•Case Details. Despite the payment of a ransom, the body of 20-month old Charles A. Lindbergh Jr. was found dead 73 days later, apparently having been killed close to the time of the kidnapping. See details at Court TV Crime Library.
•Contents of Note. "Dear Sir! Have 50,000$ redy 2500$ in 20$ bills 1 5000$ in 10$ bills and 10000$ in 5$ bills. After 2-4 days we will inform you were to deliver the Mony. We warn you for making anyding public or for the polise the child is in gut care. Indication for all letters are signature and 3 holes" (full note here (link provided by Internet poster Athena).
•Side-by-Side Comparison to Ramsey Note. A link to a scan of the note used in the case of the kidnapping of the Lindbergh baby, along a detailed comparison of the details of that case with the JBR case is contained in a letter from New York lawyer Darnay Hoffman to Boulder DA Alex Hunter.
Susan Degnan (1946)
•Case Details. "A killer left a ransom note when he took Suzanne Degnan, 6, from her home in the middle of the night on January 6, 1946. Her dismembered body was found the next day. A child molester named Richard Thomas confessed to the murder, though notorious killer William Heirens also confessed to the killing. In either event, it was clearly a sex murder and not a kidnapping, regardless of the note. See the Court TV Crime Library." Source: Laura James at Clews The Historic True Crime Blog.
•Contents of Note. "Get $20,000 ready & waite (sic) for word. Do not notify FBI or police. Bills in $5’s and $10’s." On the backside was a warning: "Burn this for her safty (sic)" (Crime Library).
Peter Weinberger (1956)
•Case Details. Weinberger, an infant 33 days old, was kidnapped from the patio of his home 10 minutes after his mother placed him in a carriage. Despite several abortive attempts to deliver the specified ransom amount, the baby was never returned, and the kidnapper later confessed he had abandoned the baby (later found dead) shortly after the kidnapping. (Newsday.com).
•Contents of Note. "The ransom note was scrawled in green ink on a sheet torn from a student notebook. ‘Attention,’ it said. ‘I’m sorry this had to happen, but I am in bad need of money, & couldn’t get it any other way. Don’t tell anyone or go to the police about this, because I am watching you closely. I am scared stiff, & will kill the baby at your first wrong move … Your baby sitter.’ It demanded $2,000 in small bills. The money was to be placed in a brown envelope and left near the Weinberger home, next to a signpost at Albemarle Road and Park Avenue, at 10 o’clock the next morning." Newsday.com (link provided by Internet poster Athena).
Gail Jackson (1978)
•Case Details. After murdering prostitute Gail Jackson, William Hance sent 5 letters to the Chief of Police to avert suspicion from himself (opinion).
•Contents of Notes. "The letters were signed "Forces of Evil," a fictitious group the appellant had created. The second of these letters received by the Chief of Police demanded either the apprehension of the Columbus strangler or a $10,000 ransom in return for the victim’s safety. In addition, the appellant found an Army Cap with a different unit insignia than his unit and placed this near the crime scene, also in order to avert suspicion" opinion(link provided by Internet poster Athena). Donald Pugh has observed that this note used the line "We are an organization composed of seven members."
Clark Handa (1984)
•Case Details. Handa, age 3, "was kidnapped from his own home in 1984. A ransom note was left behind. Clark has never been found, and no one ever tried to collect any ransom for his return." details.
Source: Laura James at Clews The Historic True Crime Blog.
ALSO: Mentioned by vlpate – "Zahra Baker case. The police found a ransom note at the step mother’s home….they found Zahra had been dismembered in the bathtub. Zahra’s step mother said the precious little girl had died and the father dismembered her."
NOTE: Some objected that many of the case I cited the dead child was not found in the home, as JonBenet was.
AK Wilks: I was responding to the post quoted above. It asked why kill a child and leave a ransom note? I provided 6 cases were the child was killed, and a ransom note was left.
You say for most of them "no similarity"? Come on. Do they have to have left the child in a basement? Also be in Colorado? Of course you will seldom have two criminal situations exactly alike in every way.
The poster asked for situations where the child was dead, yet the killers left their handwriting in a ransom note. I provided a link to six.
Crimes, in particular a home invasion abduction/murder, in particular if done by a mentally disturbed person, is a very fluid situation. We don’t know what happened, what went right, what went wrong, what was unexpected, what changed on spur of the moment, whether the plan was abduction for ransom with the murder unintended, abduction for sexual slavery with the murder unintended or planned murder with the ransom note as a diversion.
The point is there is historical precedent for a stranger/intruder to kill a child and yet still leave a ransom note.
———- ———- ———- ———-
Quote:
Posted by Chrishope
Much further up the thread, you had indicated a reluctance to answer hypothetical questions. But I think your theory is incomplete unless you can come up with some plausible explanations of why BDM/WB would do the following –
A) Leave the body in the house where it’s likely to be found, thus making it impossible to collect the ransom.
B) If it’s a "kidnapping gone bad" what went wrong to foil the original abduction plan?
I realize you can’t say definitively what happened that night. I’m just asking you to support your theory with some plausible explanation of why Mitchel would do these things.
AK Wilks: When BDM took Elizabeth Smart, she said she awoke to have a knife pressed against her neck. Had she jumped up or screamed, she might have died.
I can speculate that the ransom note was left either as a real attempt to get money (doubtful but possible, BDM wanted to start a church, and the paper days before said Ramsey had a billion dollar in sales) or as a diversion. BDM took JonBenet to the basement, perhaps to exit through a window perhaps for sex, and then either:
1. She screamed or resisted and he used too much force to silence her, either force on the noose he had prior or force by a blow from an object.
2. Being a sick pedophile, he gave in to his lust to "consumate the marriage" right there, with the added perverse thrill of the parents sleeping upstairs, and got carried away in his sadism, applying to much force on the noose.
There are other scenarios as well. WB states BDM once threw his own child against a bed headboard in anger. I can see BDM or a like pedophile intruder being far more likely to accidentailly, recklessly or intentionally kill JonBenet than Patsy, John or Burke.
It was reported that after losing custody of her kids, WB would walk around with a DOLL that she would dress and care for. Some aspects of the event, like the clothes change, packing a Dr. Seuss book and bedding or giving her pineapple to eat, could have come from this desire to have a child. Also BDM was persuasive in getting compliance from his child victims, through a mix of force, threats and comforts and reassuring talk, and charismatic religious talk.
Chrishope:
OK. That’s possible.
———– ———– ————
Finally, this is the actual transcript of Elizabeth Smart’s testimony:
http://media.bonnint.net/slc/1473/147302/14730295.pdf
Many intersting things, including this from page 44:
8 Q. Okay. He performed a marriage ceremony that night.
9 I mean, was this a lengthy thing? A very short thing?
10 A. Very short.
11 Q. Okay. What did he say, do you remember?
12 A. He just said that in the power that was vested in
13 him he bonded me on heaven — or that I would be bound in
14 heaven as I would be here on earth to him to be his wife. I
15 screamed no. But that did not have any affect on him. And he
16 said that if I were to scream then he would kill me.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:47 pm
Based on the informtion from Doug Oswell, Kite and myself, I think Brian David Mitchell must be investigated in this case.
I just now aksed the Boulder PD this question:
Boulder PD has issued a statement saying that the suspect DNA in the JonBenet case did NOT match any Ramsey family members.
Can you tell me if Brian David Mitchell does NOT match the suspect DNA in the Ramsey case?
Thank you.
AK Wilks
——————————-
I got this answer:
As I mentioned earlier, we are unable to share any information concerning the Ramsey case.
sandy betts, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Oct 30, 2011 1:26 am
I never felt that the Ramsey’s had anything to do with harming her.
I am sorry, but the idea that the sicko who took Elizabeth Smart, could be the same person who killed Jon Benet, sounds like a real stretch to me.
To me the ransom note is a much closer match to the Zodiac’s printing , adding a umbrella over the a , than to Mitchell’s.
The q in that ransom note is a perfect match to the q in the Belli letter.( along with many other Z like letters) Also the writer mentions a line from the Dirty Harry movie, which we all know was about Zodiac.
Wouldn’t hence be used by someone who also uses shall and shan’t ? The person who wrote the note was very shaky, like a very old man, or a very nervous man. A lot like the person Harnell said seemed very nervous.
Mitchell took Elizabeth Short, because he knew her , he had done some work for the family. Very different than in the Ramsey case, to me anyway.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:53 pm
Sandy and anyone else interested in this case – you need to go to page one of this thread and carefully read and study from the first post on.
There is a lot of good information and evidence to suggest Brian David Mitchell should be looked at as a suspect in the JonBenet case.
And while the Boulder PD has issued statements saying the Ramsey family and all local sex offenders did NOT match the DNA found on JonBenet’s body, they DECLINED to do so for Mitchell when I gave them the chance. I take that to mean the comparison has not yet been made and Mitchell has not yet been ruled out.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:07 pm
[flash(425,350)] http://www.youtube.com/v/jvMcfMHsJY4 [/flash]
sandy betts, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sat Nov 26, 2011 9:39 pm
I re-read the whole thread and still feel the same. I studied this case from day 1. I also new about the Elizabeth Smart case, your POI would have taken JonBenet… Not killed her.
My Granddaughter phoned me after she found a picture of JonBenets body on the Internet, before it was ever released to public. I at the time did not have a computer, she did not have a printer. So I ask her to describe what she saw in the picture, she saw her body and near her head was a baseball bat (Nobody knew about the baseball bat at the time). At the bottom of the picture was a cipher of six letters. I asked her to describe the cipher to me and I drew it out. I then checked it against the solved ciphers, and the word was Zodiac. It was at that point I became obsessed with the case. I then notice the similarities and tone and Z like lettering in the Ransom note. It also referred to a movie about Zodiac. Whoever did this hinted to Zodiac not a pedophile.
I gave this information immediately to Boulder PD, of course never heard back from them. They were honed in on her family at the time.
onewhoknows, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sat Nov 26, 2011 11:23 pm
I never heard about the cipher in the photo of Jon Benet Ramsey. I was also disturbed, like
Sandy, by some of the phrasing, misspellings, and similar printing to the Zodiac’s. I too, long
ago noticed the umbrella over the little "a", some of which the writer missed. I do feel the comparison
to the creep that kidnapped Elizabeth Smart is very intersting as well.
Luke68, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Nov 27, 2011 2:33 am
I have no background to this case so these are purely my own questions and observations on the details posted here.
1. Do we know for certain that Barzee wrote the journal with her left hand? I would expect at least some smudging if this were the case. It looks more to me like a deliberate, copied writing than an instinctive style that changed because the person switched hands.
2. Related to this, in the Barzee interview where she explains how she came to learn to write with her left hand, the explanation and the detail therein smacks of fabrication. It sounds practiced to me.
Again, I have read nothing other than the argument put forward here but based on the information it seems to me extremely probable that both crimes (Ramsey and Smart) were committed by the same individuals.
sandy betts, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Nov 27, 2011 12:20 pm
You can make a good argument out of most anything ,when one makes assumptions and turns the facts to fit a scenario.( I am not accusing anyone here of doing that on purpose, to deceive)The fact is we don’t know how the saliva got on her body. It could have been from a sneeze/cough/drool. Mitchell took young girls to keep as his wife’s, to molest them. We have no evidence that he ever changed his MO to kill and torture in the manner that JonBenet was. Her killer was cut from a different cloth. Mitchell was a sick pedophile,JonBenet’s killer was a very evil sadistic sociopath.
John Ramsey had his business connections in San Mateo, Calif. (Access Graphics). I believe that the killer knew John Ramsey from his business.
I noticed in one of the videos of JonBenet, in the background on the right side, there were two or three steps. There was a man on those steps,who turned in the direction of her, he had on clothes as if he was working construction there. The video didn’t show his face, his jeans were that of a older man, baggy. I wish that they would have shown his face, just in case Mr. Ramsey recognised him. My feeling is that it was a much older man with E.D., who killed JonBenet, or she would have been raped.
This is what I believe, and can not be taken as fact. We share our thoughts here, then mull them over, not criticizing anyone for thinking the way they do.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:28 pm
I have no background to this case so these are purely my own questions and observations on the details posted here.
1. Do we know for certain that Barzee wrote the journal with her left hand? I would expect at least some smudging if this were the case. It looks more to me like a deliberate, copied writing than an instinctive style that changed because the person switched hands.
2. Related to this, in the Barzee interview where she explains how she came to learn to write with her left hand, the explanation and the detail therein smacks of fabrication. It sounds practiced to me.
Again, I have read nothing other than the argument put forward here but based on the information it seems to me extremely probable that both crimes (Ramsey and Smart) were committed by the same individuals.
Luke – I agree with you. She seems to have lied – the question is why?
Boulder PD will NOT issue a clearance on BDM and WB.
Sandy – Lots of good info, thanks, I have to study it more.
Dreamnine, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:31 pm
What are your thoughts now, AK on Mitchell and JonBenet Ramsay?
Another new book is out, and I find the many threads on WS both conflicting and tiresome: it was/wasn’t the parents etc.
Do you think we’ll ever know?
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Sun Jul 22, 2012 5:38 pm
What are your thoughts now, AK on Mitchell and JonBenet Ramsay?
Another new book is out, and I find the many threads on WS both conflicting and tiresome: it was/wasn’t the parents etc.
Do you think we’ll ever know?
1. I still think BDM/WB are excellent suspects in the JonBenet case and every effort to include/exclude them should be made. Boulder PD does not share info with me. So I don’t know where it stands. All you can really do is pass along info, do the research, double check, ask if they want it, and if they do send it in. You don’t get much in the way of follow up. They either take a serious look at it or they don’t. Not much you can do.
2. Yes I see a detective has a new book, he thinks no intruder. I guess he points the finger at the parents. Fine, but how did the unknown male DNA get on JonBenet and her panties? Who did that DNA come from? What is the motive for the Ramseys to kill their own daughter? What about things in the ransom note pointing away from the parents, and the matches to BDM/WB?
3. Probably we will never know. Unless we get a DNA hit to BDM or someone.
See here for the best stuff on the possible BDM/WB connection to the case, with excellent contributions by Oswell and Kite and others:
http://unazod.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=136
Dreamnine, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Feb 25, 2013 12:53 pm
One of the more bizarre theories (but a good read!) here: http://www.angelfire.com/planet/check/burke.html
I’ve just started reading a book on this case…I tried it once before but gave up halfway through. I think what I find aggravating about this case is its stubborn persistence; that, and the fact that the BPD really messed it up from the beginning.
tahoe27, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:08 pm
After seeing the photo of her little hands tied up and the strangulation device used, there is no doubt in my mind her parents were not involved. The DNA as mentioned as well.
Dreamnine, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:14 pm
I’m not sure whether they can be ruled out – if not in the actual killing then at least in covering up.
The ransom note is the big thing for me – I just don’t see anyone other than PR writing it.
AK Wilks, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:23 pm
The DA says the DNA rules out the Ramsey’s.
The asst to the police chief says – or hints – that my POI has not yet been ruled out.
Dreamnine, Subject: Re: A Possible New Suspect In JonBenet Ramsey Case? Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:27 pm
The DA might say that, but it’s still a pretty divisive topic.
I think this is one case which we might never truly know.
MODERATOR
Well it has been about 7 yrs sense the suspects were looked at and nothing has happened like an arrest, so I am assuming they were innocent?
Over these past 7 yrs I have watched every interview with John Ramsey I could find. There have been documentaries , TV shows etc and still nothing. Hopefully the Genetic Detective will have another season and will do Jonbenet’s case as well as the Zodiac case?
The Barbie doll present that was left at the crime scene looked very much like Jonbenet when she would dress for the pageants. Pam Huckaby received a Barbie doll in a small coffin by the person claiming to be Zodiac. The little white Christmas bear that was also found and was not from the Ramsey family, was very much like the Christmas bear that was left for me by my Zodiac suspect. Only mine was a golden bear with a hat and scarf like Jonbenet’s bear.( The same company made both) Those could be just another odd coincidence or maybe not? I took the golden bear to be a clue to UC Berkeley’s mascot. My other suspect worked there as a printer who later was into "graphics".
The person who wrote the ransom note was a true movie buff, because he used words from several movies to compose the "3" page note
Don’t try to grow a brain was from the movie "Speed". The movie "Die Hard" had words close to and about foreign Faction, The movie" Ruthless" Listen very carefully.
You talk to a cop, you even look at a cop , your daughter is dead. That could have come from the movie Ransom. "Now listen very carefully" was from the Dirty Harry movie and we know who that movie was about. ( The movie Ransom , with Mel Gibson came out Nov.8th 1996 ) So it was still very fresh on the killer’s mind.It gave details about the exact amount of money the kidnaper wanted and what to use to put the money in. Very much like the orders given to John in the Ramsey note.
The very night Jonbenet was murdered, there was a movie on cable TV at 7:30 pm in Boulder called "Nick Of Time" It was about a kidnaping of a six yr old girl . The kidnapper spoke about cutting off her head! I can’t think of more than one sick killer who got most of his ideas from books and movies, who had printing that matched and who also liked killing on holidays. I never for even a split second ,felt anyone in her family was her killer.
I still believe the killer was at the open house they had, took the paper and pen needed for the ransom note. And was the person who phoned 911 that night, as a test to see how long it would take the police to arrive. I don’t think he wrote the note the night he killed her, I believe he wrote it where ever he was staying, long before he got into the house. His intention I think was to kidnap her when he wrote it, but something happened to stop that from happening.
It’s been an age since I’ve closely followed Zodiac or the Ramsey case, so please do forgive me here, but I am wildly confused as to why Zodiac, who largely murdered significantly older teen couples in public, would break into a family home to murder a 6 year old?
Nearly 30 years after his last known crime no less? And to then not taunt the police by taking credit like he did with the other crimes. Zodiac did not like the thought of anyone taking credit for what he did so why would he write a ransom note blaming a group of people?? I’m not trying to annoy anyone here just trying to understand how one arrives at Zodiac being responsible for JonBenet…
To preface I think it’s great people do research. Who knows what might happen.
Watching the Ramsey’s deposition where they had to deny their own handwriting in the family photo albums is one of the most inexplicable things I have ever seen in terms of someone maintaining their innocence in any case, ever.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13yP2ugwR5M&t
How is that not someone obfuscating because they know the handwriting in the family photo album is like the handwriting in the ransom note?
At 5 minutes in her lawyer realizes how this is going and tries to stop it. I am surprised it took him so long but he could do nothing. I didn’t think he realized how good these lawyers were going to be. This was for the civil lawsuit by their house staff I think or something like that.
I really like Kolar’s book. It makes a lot of sense.
For example how do we explain the digestive contents of JBR which contained pineapple with family members prints on the bowl of pineapple? How does that fit in their narrative? The science behind both digestive pathology and fingerprints are pretty good.
Did you know the intruder put the pen and notepad back where they had gotten them from after they used them?
IMO, Mr. Ramsey is completely innocent and just doing what probably any father who has lost another child already would do. I think he realized at some point during the event what had really happened and did a 180 degree shift, called his lawyers and just plowed money into it to try to salvage his family from institutional interference. It sort of didn’t work because I don’t think he realized the size of the PR campaign needed to maintain it but at the same time it did work because no was held accountable.
So what are people’s thoughts on those points?
www.zodiachalloweencard.com has a 400 paged book for free containing the super solution with an overarching explanation of the cards and more.
candycoated, This was not the first time her killer murdered someone, he appears to be a seasoned killer who was comfortable hanging around inside of that home. I can not say for sure that Zodiac was her killer, it is that so many things like the writing and wording reminded of Zodiac. The knots for the garott were similar to the knots used to tie up Bryan and Cecelia. Zodiac did write about killing children, that sounds like he would have no problem killing a child to me. You know only about the known Zodiac murders, you don’t know that he may have kept his word about changing his MO and not telling who he killed.
I am basically going by my Zodiac suspect who gives me clues to who he has murdered , that you know nothing about. Do you honestly believe that Zodiac was not capable of killing children? Napa believes he killed a very small child there and put her body in a field. He didn’t phone the police or write to brag about every murder he commited. There still are sevearl in southern Calif. that he now admits to killing but hasn’t named them. If a murder points me in the direction of a possible Zodiac victim, I don’t just tell myself he couldn’t do that, if it looks like something he could have done I look into it. I have notes from my suspect that look very much like the Ramsey note, including one that shows a drawing of himself with two victims, one in Vallejo 1974 ,the other a 14 yr old girl murdered inside of her home in Castro Valley 1994. Pryor to the 1994 victim there was one other inside her home in SF, I don’t have my notes on her. In that drawing, he drew red hearts, one way off in the distance, did you know the killer drew a red heart on Jonbenet’s palm? My suspect gave me a map of the people he claims he has killed in northern Calif. that was in the 1980’s, there were over 70 then. That was before the 12 he claimed in Pittsburg / Antioch Ca. during the late 80’s though the 1990’s. He actually phoned the police to tell them where to find my daughters friend Andrea Ingersoll’s body and then told them he was the Zodiac. You know nothing about that ,because it was never put in any newspaper or on TV. Just because you don’t know about something happening ,doesn’t mean it didn’t or couldn’t happen. I have two suspects, one who worked in Graphics. John Ramsey had a" graphic" business. The other worked in construction. In one of Jonbenet’s video’s there was a man working construction in the background who stopped to watch her. It didn’t show his face, it was from his neck down , he looked about 5 ft 9 or 10, stocky with baggy pants. I believe that Zodiac should be considered a suspect in her case. Check his DNA to what was found at the crime scene as well as the palm print. LE has part of Zodiac’s palm print on one of his letters, compare it to the one found at the crime scene, how much work would that be?
candycoated, This was not the first time her killer murdered someone, he appears to be a seasoned killer who was comfortable hanging around inside of that home. I can not say for sure that Zodiac was her killer, it is that so many things like the writing and wording reminded of Zodiac. The knots for the garott were similar to the knots used to tie up Bryan and Cecelia. Zodiac did write about killing children, that sounds like he would have no problem killing a child to me. You know only about the known Zodiac murders, you don’t know that he may have kept his word about changing his MO and not telling who he killed.
I am basically going by my Zodiac suspect who gives me clues to who he has murdered , that you know nothing about. Do you honestly believe that Zodiac was not capable of killing children? Napa believes he killed a very small child there and put her body in a field. He didn’t phone the police or write to brag about every murder he commited. There still are sevearl in southern Calif. that he now admits to killing but hasn’t named them. If a murder points me in the direction of a possible Zodiac victim, I don’t just tell myself he couldn’t do that, if it looks like something he could have done I look into it. I have notes from my suspect that look very much like the Ramsey note, including one that shows a drawing of himself with two victims, one in Vallejo 1974 ,the other a 14 yr old girl murdered inside of her home in Castro Valley 1994. Pryor to the 1994 victim there was one other inside her home in SF, I don’t have my notes on her. In that drawing, he drew red hearts, one way off in the distance, did you know the killer drew a red heart on Jonbenet’s palm? My suspect gave me a map of the people he claims he has killed in northern Calif. that was in the 1980’s, there were over 70 then. That was before the 12 he claimed in Pittsburg / Antioch Ca. during the late 80’s though the 1990’s. He actually phoned the police to tell them where to find my daughters friend Andrea Ingersoll’s body and then told them he was the Zodiac. You know nothing about that ,because it was never put in any newspaper or on TV. Just because you don’t know about something happening ,doesn’t mean it didn’t or couldn’t happen. I have two suspects, one who worked in Graphics. John Ramsey had a" graphic" business. The other worked in construction. In one of Jonbenet’s video’s there was a man working construction in the background who stopped to watch her. It didn’t show his face, it was from his neck down , he looked about 5 ft 9 or 10, stocky with baggy pants. I believe that Zodiac should be considered a suspect in her case. Check his DNA to what was found at the crime scene as well as the palm print. LE has part of Zodiac’s palm print on one of his letters, compare it to the one found at the crime scene, how much work would that be?
I personally don’t think that Zodiac would go on to kill children. He threatened to blow up a bus full of them but I was always of the opinion that he did that simply to dick the police around and cause a panic. One comment about that to then breaking into / lurking in a house and then garotting a child is quite the step up. But of course, yes it could happen and killers evolve over time given enough of it so I was not challenging you, just asking for clarification. Clearly you have decades worth of extra info that the suspect apparently drew up for you himself, which was very forthcoming of him! I only hope all this plethora of info helps to identify both Zodiac and JonBenets killer/s some day.
You are entitled to think and believe whatever you want. The person who I am very sure is Zodiac, is worse than you know, he evolved into worse than a evil person. I know of victims who were brutally beaten and "tortured slowly" to death by this scum bag. You may not believe that Kathleen Johns was one of his victims, I believe she was, he told her to throw her baby out of the car window! Zodiac didn’t just write about blowing up a bus with children in it, he said he would shoot the kiddies as they came bouncing out of the bus. He went after easy targets, "children" make good targets were his own words. Zodiac escalated pretty fast from shooting couples in cars at night, to stabbing in daylight , with in a few months. It has been years now, he has evolved so much more than you can imagine! He tried to break into my home a few times, it wasn’t to have tea and crumpets! There are many things that none of us know about Zodiac. The man who claims to be Zodiac, let me know that I have only half of the story about him.
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I know I am. I’ve likely barely scratched the surface of Zodiac and am sure I’m not even aware of some details that are even semi known these days, and those I do know of can easily slip my mind, I readily admit all that. Which is why ask these questions and provide my limited viewpoint, I like to be corrected by those who basically have total recall on this case and others. It helps me learn.
I’m open to many Zodiac possibilities because this crazy showed in a short space of time that he was willing and happy to try different methods of killing and attacking so yes, he could have evolved to killing JobBenet, I just find myself not convinced with that one because to me they just don’t have enough evidence that he is likely for it.
Do you have any idea why your suspect would terrorize you for so long and so aggressively by the way? It happens to people obviously, EARONS did it via prank calls like a decade or two later. If you’d rather not comment then fair enough, just I wonder why you? I’ve read enough to know you’re well regarded here but I don’t know your story or possible relation to the case if any at all for him to go at you so often? Why hasn’t he succeeded in breaking in and doing his thing?
I know I am. I’ve likely barely scratched the surface of Zodiac and am sure I’m not even aware of some details that are even semi known these days, and those I do know of can easily slip my mind, I readily admit all that. Which is why ask these questions and provide my limited viewpoint, I like to be corrected by those who basically have total recall on this case and others. It helps me learn.
I’m open to many Zodiac possibilities because this crazy showed in a short space of time that he was willing and happy to try different methods of killing and attacking so yes, he could have evolved to killing JobBenet, I just find myself not convinced with that one because to me they just don’t have enough evidence that he is likely for it.
Do you have any idea why your suspect would terrorize you for so long and so aggressively by the way? It happens to people obviously, EARONS did it via prank calls like a decade or two later. If you’d rather not comment then fair enough, just I wonder why you? I’ve read enough to know you’re well regarded here but I don’t know your story or possible relation to the case if any at all for him to go at you so often? Why hasn’t he succeeded in breaking in and doing his thing?
I am happy to post about anything I can to help with getting this person caught, I have nothing to hide. I can only speculate as to why I believe he has done this for so long.
Zodiac went after waitresses in the Vallejo area in the late 60’s, I was one of those waitress. Two of us dated a Vallejo Cop named Buzz Gordon. According to Buzz in a phone call in 1990, he told me he went out with Darlene only one time, he and I dated 5 yrs, I had no idea he was married at that time! I was also going out with Don Porter who" unknowingly" was involved in a counterfeit, drug and car theft ring, who mentioned Dee who was also involved in that same ring. Don had a roommate who could very well be my stalker, he was very upset that Don had mentioned the name Dee in front of me.I think this man thought I was told about the ring from Don and had planned to get rid of me? He failed but continued to taunt me. My story is long and extremely complicated, it has been edited by two other people and made to be a much easier read on Zodiackiller.com site, under "The Sandy Betts Story" thread. There are pictures of what the costume looked like that was planted in my car at the end of Sept 1969. A few of the letters and notes this man who claims to be Zodiac has sent to me over the yrs can also be seen on that thread. Different handwriting experts told me those were from thee Zodiac! It was on this site as well ,but photobucket removed the pictures. This man has broken into my home, I was not there thank goodness! He has shot at me and missed either on purpose or not? When I took his picture in 1990 and told him I gave it to the police and that if anything happened to me, he would be caught, because I gave his picture and documentation to each police dept. That was when he tried to make it look like an accident.
By using reverse psychology and not killing me, makes it harder for people to believe he could be the zodiac playing games with me, it makes me look like a crazy old woman who imagines all of these things happening. I am ok with people thinking I am crazy,that keeps me safe. If and when I am taken seriously, it could become more dangerous for me and my family. Please read my true story to get a better understanding of why I am so sure this man or his best buddy is the Zodiac. It also shows a picture of a letter/drawing, that is a clue to Jonbenet’s murder. ( The "red heart" far off in the distance that matches what was drawn on the palm of her hand).
