Discussion of Ross Sullivan goes here..Can a Mod that knows how to do it, carry over the Ross SUllivan thread from the old forum and place it here? I accidentally deleted the thread, as well as the Sullivan pics, etc.

(Edited to add the old files: Morf…I added it here so the info remained first in the thread. If you would like it elsewhere, just let me know. Tahoe27)

morf13, Subject: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Fri Oct 28, 2011 11:22 pm

Sandy sent me this, and I have been meaning to post it. Apparently, the RCC library staff had their pick for a suspect in the Bates case, as you can see in this letter from one of them. I did a bit of searching, and found this guy living in Riverside during the last decade or two, but didnt find any sign of him in Vallejo.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Fri Oct 28, 2011 11:37 pm

Actually, I think I may have found a record of this guy in Santa Cruz, just as it is mentioned in the letter above. If it is the same guy, He died in 1977. He was born in NY, wonder if it was in Albany? (Possible Z letter from Albany)If I verify he is dead, I will post an unedited version of the letter that shpws his name. Maybe Foreigner, Seagull, etc would help me verify if it is the same guy.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Fri Oct 28, 2011 11:44 pm

Howard already listed his name publicly here:
http://zodiackiller.21.forumer.com/a/po … 1&start=65

and here:
http://www.zodiackiller.com/mba/cjb/392.html

It is Ross Sullivan, and I believe he died in Santa Cruz in 1977.

Nachtsider, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Oct 29, 2011 4:44 am

Large guy. Mental health issues. Solitary, perhaps lonely. Church (‘Christmass’? ‘To the slaughter like a lamb’?). White ink (like the kind used on Zodiac’s Halloween card?).

Hmmm.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Oct 29, 2011 7:28 am

I searched with no luck for a photo of this guy. Maybe one of our people in the bay area can get an obituary from the local papers. He died in 1977. Will have to find the date again. By the way, the guy I found in Riverside with the name ROSS SULLIVAN was the wrong guy, that one was too old to be the guy in this report.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Oct 29, 2011 7:32 am

I searched with no luck for a photo of this guy. Maybe one of our people in the bay area can get an obituary from the local papers. He died in 1977. Will have to find the date again. By the way, the guy I found in Riverside with the name ROSS SULLIVAN was the wrong guy, that one was too old to be the guy in this report.

ROSS M. SULLIVAN, born July 28, 1941in NY state. Died Sept 29, 1977 in Santa Cruz. Anybody able to look for an obituary for him that might include more info or a photo? Here is a SS#564-56-7947

bentley, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:53 am

Well a "huge" slob does sound like the confession letter type, and he was in a good position to write on a desk. Apparently no one could get close enough to the stench to check out his watch, or lack of. Died young, wonder what of.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Oct 29, 2011 5:21 pm

Well a "huge" slob does sound like the confession letter type, and he was in a good position to write on a desk. Apparently no one could get close enough to the stench to check out his watch, or lack of. Died young, wonder what of.

I wondered that too….suicide???If so, why?

Nachtsider, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Oct 29, 2011 7:57 pm

I wondered that too….suicide???If so, why?

Plunging himself into the billowy wave, with an echo arising from the suicide’s grave…?

bentley, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Oct 29, 2011 11:18 pm

Hmm, that’s eerie, being Z’s last real dead ringer of a letter (no pun intended). Santa Cruz right on the ocean of course.

sandy betts, Subject: Letter about Ross Sat Oct 29, 2011 11:23 pm

Morf , I am pretty sure this letter was sent to me by my dear friend Howard. He and I have shared information over the yrs. If anyone would know all about Ross, it would be Howard.
I will see what else I can find and send it to you, or post it.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sun Oct 30, 2011 10:14 am

Morf , I am pretty sure this letter was sent to me by my dear friend Howard. He and I have shared information over the yrs. If anyone would know all about Ross, it would be Howard.
I will see what else I can find and send it to you, or post it.

Sounds good.

zodio, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 07, 2011 12:47 am

If he died in ’77’ then he would not have sent the Eureka card.

sandy betts, Subject: I wish the the Zodiac died in 77 ! Mon Nov 07, 2011 12:01 pm

If he died in ’77’ then he would not have sent the Eureka card.

Correct zodio, He couldn’t have written the 4-24-78 either. This was a letter that received much attention, the experts however saw it as the real deal.( It was also different in tone.)

Nachtsider, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 07, 2011 5:08 pm

Only Sherwood Morrill said that the 1978 letter was authentic, but in truth, I feel that the missive is worthless as evidence in light of all the politics surrounding it.

The Eureka card poses problems for a case against this guy, but I’m not going to drop him just yet. He may not be Zodiac, but he might still be Cheri’s killer.

sandy betts, Subject: Fake ? Tue Nov 08, 2011 11:18 am

It is my understanding that there were others who felt it was the real deal.
John Shimoda , the head of the postal crime lab ,and Dave DeGarmo ,were also handwriting experts, who said it was the Zodiac’s printing.
Det Toschi admitted to writing one letter, it wasn’t a "signed Zodiac" letter.

I spoke to Dave Toschi in the early 70 ‘s, ( He phoned me a few times ).
Of all the Z Det. I have spoken to over the past 40 yrs , he was the most knowledgeable and the most dedicated .
Its too bad what happened to Toschi, because of the Roper Agency.
Ironically I met Ron Pimentel , of that agency in 1989 at my job in Oakland ,LOL. He told me then that he felt it was a forgery. ( He was never a handwriting expert ) He died shortly after he tried to help me catch my poi, who had started stalking him in Oakland Ca.
I feel badly that I haven’t checked to see how he died yet ?

AK Wilks, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:16 pm

If he died in ’77’ then he would not have sent the Eureka card.

True, and as mentioned, he also could not have done ANY of the 1978 letters, the April probable fake or the May possible real, or the Atlanta 1981 letter, or the 1986 letter, or the 1990 Xmas card.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:38 pm

Sandy sent me this, and I have been meaning to post it. Apparently, the RCC library staff had their pick for a suspect in the Bates case, as you can see in this letter from one of them. I did a bit of searching, and found this guy living in Riverside during the last decade or two, but didnt find any sign of him in Vallejo.

I sent off an FOIA request to the FBI for this individual regarding any zodiac investigation of him. I am waiting to hear back. I have requested info on about 3 or 4 deceased individuals,and so far they all have had the standard reply.."Searches of our indexes have revealed no material for this individual"(or something similar to that). There was only one exception,and thgat was the response for the request I sent off for Rick Marshall. Their reply regarding him was that he was previously part of an investigation,but since he was ruled out,his file was destroyed(something similar to these words)

sandy betts, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:37 pm

I can’t help but think about how many serial killers were dismissed, then after a few yrs and a few victims later, were found to be guilty.
The Green River killer being one of them.

I still feel that Zodiac was once spoken to and let go, because they didn’t think this very calm polite soft spoken man could be thee Zodiac. That might be the reason why he stayed still for so long ? The other being the close call minutes after Paul Stine was shot.

In the letter above, it states that this person was believed to be in a mental hospital near the Santa Cruz area. Kathleen Johns worked at one in the San Jose area, which is not that far from Santa Cruz. Interesting just how many people we can build a pretty good case against ?

zodio, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sun Mar 18, 2012 12:22 am

Howard is familiar with this guy so I’ll let him share what info he has.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Wed Mar 28, 2012 5:32 pm

Got the FBI response about this guy, they have NO RECORD of ever having investigated him in the Z crimes

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:06 pm

Just revisiting ROSS M. SULLIVAN as a suspect. Can any of our team in the SF bay area turn up an obituary for him? He died on Sept 29,1977 in Santa Cruz,so an obituary would have been likely in the papers later that week.

More about Ross,

DOB 7/28/41

His SS# was issued in CA in 1958,but before that, I think he may have been born or spent time in New York.

I have been trying without success to find a photo of him. He supposedly hung around RCC and was previously a student there,but isnt in any of the RCC yearbooks that I can find.

Guy seems pretty interesting,hope we can dig more up on him

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:38 pm

Looks like I will do this the hard way…

Looking at all the people with last name of SULLIVAN in the 66 Riverside directory, trying to figure out which one may be related to Ross Sullivan. I found an ANNA N. SULLIVAN in Riverside in 66. In searching for people with that name in CA, there are very few. I think I found her before Riverside living in SANTA BARBARA. Hmmm

patinky, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 13, 2012 10:49 pm

Morf,

FYI, this doesn’t help but I made an effort to find his photo through some various sources as well as trying to find a 1977 obit. No luck.

patinky, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:03 pm

Looks like I will do this the hard way…

Looking at all the people with last name of SULLIVAN in the 66 Riverside directory, trying to figure out which one may be related to Ross Sullivan. I found an ANNA N. SULLIVAN in Riverside in 66. In searching for people with that name in CA, there are very few. I think I found her before Riverside living in SANTA BARBARA. Hmmm

She’s too old to be his mother if this is her (I can pull the entire census if you need it):

Anna N Sullivan in the 1940 Census
Age 61, born abt 1879
Birthplace California
Gender Female
Race White
Home in 1940
2127 Hollister Avenue
Santa Barbara,
Santa Barbara, California
Household Members Age
Head Jas P Sullivan 61
Wife Anna N Sullivan 61
Sister Lenara Edwards 68

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:20 pm

I was thinking a Grandmother….but, the problem is, ROSS M. SULLIVAN was born in NEW YORK in 1941, and his ss# was issued in CA in 1958 or 59. Not sure what year he came to CA, and cant find any of his pics or verify his parents or siblings.

sandy betts, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:18 pm

Morf, Are you sure you have the correct Ross M Sullivan ? I found a Ross Michael Sullivan who died in Riverside 2008.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:37 pm

Morf, Are you sure you have the correct Ross M Sullivan ? I found a Ross Michael Sullivan who died in Riverside 2008.

The letter from the librarians said that the Ross M. Sullivan that they thought may have killed Cheri, moved to Santa Cruz in 1967 or so,and transferred his school records up there. A Ross M. Sullivan died in Santa Cruz in 1977 at the age of 36. I dont now he died, but I sent away for his death certificate. The letter from the library staff also mentioned he had a youger Brother,not sure of his name. I dont see any record of the Ross Sullivan you are talking about that died in 2008 in Riverside. If you would like,send me the info and I will check it out.

I think this guy is an interesting suspect. He knew Cheri Jo Bates in Riverside, moved to the SF area in time for the Z murders, he fit the overall z description, and he died in 1977 after the last confirmed Z letter was mailed.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:06 pm

Had found a couple possible relatives(fathers in southern CA area)…..

Name:
Ross D Sullivan
Residence Year:
1960
Residence Place:
Bakersfield, California
Occupation:
Farm Lab
Publication Title:
Polk’s Bakersfield (Kern County, California) City Directory

Name:

Ross Sullivan
Gender:

M (Male)
Residence Year:
1951
Street Address:
2178
Residence Place:
Long Beach, California
Occupation:
Die Mkr
Spouse:
Pearl M Sullivan
Publication Title:Polk’s Long Beach (Los Angeles County, Calif.) City Directory

Name:

Ross A Sullivan
Spouse:
Harriett Sullivan
Residence:
1954 – Santa Barbara, California, USA

A grandfather???
Name:
Ross A Sullivan
Birth:
14 Oct 1884 – Illinois
Death:
25 Jan 1964 – Riverside

Name:
Ross D Sullivan
Birth:
25 Oct 1920 – Oklahoma
Death:
22 Mar 1963 – Kern County ca

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:27 pm

This possibility interests me:

Name:
Ross A Sullivan
Spouse:
Harriett Sullivan
Residence:
1954 – Santa Barbara, California, USA

Name:
Ross A Sullivan
Birth:
14 Oct 1884 – Illinois
Death: 25 Jan 1964 – Riverside

If this Ross A. Sullivan is the same person, then he lived in Riverside in mid 60,s and in Santa Barbara previously.(Domingos/Edwards 1963 Santa Barb & Cheri Bates 1966 Riverside). This guy would be too old to be the father of the Ross Sullivan that was a Bates suspect,but he could have been his Grandfather, and if he was, we see a pattern that lines up with possible Z crimes.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:23 am

Still digging for Ross Sullivan clues….This one interested me, but I think the guy is too old, he would have been like 30 years old in 1966, cant see him hanging around college at the library as a 30 year old. Still, he WAS in both RIVERSIDE & SANTA ROSA, which lines up with what the Riverside librarians stated.(although I dont know what years)

Vernon Ross Sullivan
Vernon Ross Sullivan, age 72, of Brainerd, died at his home Friday, Aug. 7, 2009. Services for Ross will be 1 p.m. Thursday, Aug. 13 at Bethany Samaritan Village Chapel with Pastor Lilja Behr officiating. Friends are welcome to visit Wednesday evening from 5-7 p.m. at the Brenny Funeral Chapel in Baxter and one hour prior to services at Bethany on Thursday. Interment will follow at Evergreen Memorial Gardens Cemetery in Brainerd, Minn.

Arrangements have been entrusted to the Brenny Funeral Chapel of Baxter..

sandy betts, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Nov 17, 2012 1:01 pm

I agree he was a bit old , but that is where the girls are for men who like them young. Santa Cruz wasn’t mentioned in that Obit.,so think this one is the same Ross the librarian wrote about. I am interested in any janitors working at UC Riverside or Ramona High School in 65- 67. I seem to remember reading about one who went after a young girl there around that time ?

Theforeigner, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sat Nov 17, 2012 5:45 pm

Here is another Gerald Ross Sullivan.

He was born Sep 1944 in Santa Cruz and he married in Solano County Dec 1st, 1968 (and he divorced AND remarried also in Solano in 1975)

His first wife lived (in 1980) at 2500 Springs Rd in Vallejo, CA

I was thinking that due to that he fleed a mental hospital back in start 60s he might have used his middlename Ross as his first name.

I have not been able to find anything on him in the Riverside area but who knows maybe he never had his own address while living there?

I have not been able to find any picture of him either.

His son, Sean Antonio Sullivan, is a pretty scarry guy IMO who kind of threat people with murder on his facebook, you can read it at the end of this post-

California Birth Index, 1905-1995
about Gerald Ross Sullivan
Name: Gerald Ross Sullivan
Birth Date: 15 Sep 1944
Gender: Male
Mother’s Maiden Name: Soshknoff
Birth County: Santa Cruz

SULLIVAN, GERALD ROSS (Age 67)

LIVERMORE, CA
FREMONT, CA
UNION CITY, CA
SUISUN CITY, CA
FAIRFIELD, CA Possible Relatives:

SULLIVAN, SEAN ANTON (Age 69)
SULLIVAN, CELINA M (Age 36)
SULLIVAN, CHARMAINE (Age 60)
SULLIVAN, SUZZANNE JO

U.S. Public Records Index, Volume 1
about Gerald R Sullivan
Name: Gerald R Sullivan
Birth Date: 15 Sep 1944
Address: 1979 Barbour Dr, Fairfield, CA, 94534-3001 (1985)
[2073 Falcon Dr, Fairfield, CA, 94533-2408 (1995)]
[511 Wood Duck Dr, Suisun City, CA, 94585-2133]

California Marriage Index, 1960-1985
about Gerald R Sullivan
Name: Gerald R Sullivan
Age: 24
Est. Birth: abt 1944
Spouse Name: Charlene R Laroche
Spouse Age: 18
Date: 1 Dec 1968
Location: Solano

California Divorce Index, 1966-1984
about Gerald R Sullivan
Name: Gerald R Sullivan
Spouse Name: Charlene R Laroche
Location: Solano
Date: Jan 1975

California Birth Index, 1905-1995
about Charlene Rachel Laroche
Name: Charlene Rachel Laroche
Birth Date: 27 Nov 1949
Gender: Female
Mother’s Maiden Name: Foster
Birth County: San Francisco

U.S. Public Records Index, Volume 1
about Charlene R Laroche
Name: Charlene R Laroche
Birth Date: 15 Nov 1949
Address: 2500 Springs Rd Spc 115, Vallejo, CA, 94591-5664 (1980)

California Marriage Index, 1960-1985
about Gerald R Sullivan
Name: Gerald R Sullivan
Age: 31
Est. Birth: abt 1944
Spouse Name: Charmain Jessie /Nance
Spouse Age: 24
Date: 24 Oct 1975
Location: Solano

California, Marriage Index, 1960-1985
about Gerald R Sullivan
Name: Gerald R Sullivan
Age: 31
Est. Birth: abt 1944
Spouse Name: Charmain Nance
Spouse Age: 24
Est. Spouse Birth: abt 1951
Date: 24 Oct 1975
Location: Solano

California, Marriage Index, 1960-1985
about Gerald R Sullivan
Name: Gerald R Sullivan
Age: 31
Est. Birth: abt 1944
Spouse Name: Charmain Jessie
Spouse Age: 24
Est. Spouse Birth: abt 1951
Date: 24 Oct 1975
Location: Solano

Children:
California Birth Index, 1905-1995
about Sean Antonio Sullivan
Name: Sean Antonio Sullivan
Birth Date: 4 Mar 1978
Gender: Male
Mother’s Maiden Name: Jessie
Birth County: Solano

California Birth Index, 1905-1995
about Celina Mae Sullivan
Name: Celina Mae Sullivan
Birth Date: 15 Aug 1980
Gender: Female
Mother’s Maiden Name: Jessie
Birth County: Solano

This is the son Sean Antonio Sullivan facebook text about himself:

Now just to sum it all up in just a couple of lines,
My areas of expertise range from a Master Mechanic,
To a Corporate Training Sturgeon Slaying Sales Fanatic,
Now I’m a Level-Headed Businessman Father of two,
I got so much love for my sons I don’t know what to do,
So if someone would dare to try,
To come between my boys and I,
I can promise one thing that they’ll surely DIE!
So when you see me wearing my Suit and Tie,
You better be looking me in the eye,
Because behind these eyes in the shadows lay dormant,
Live’s a Bloodthirsty Demon that’s quick to kill an informant,
But that’s enough about my past let’s go to today,
I love my Mom, Dad and Sister even though they all moved away,
My boys are growing up so fast these years go by and I’m getting older,
My love for them keeps me warm in this world that’s gotten colder,
This is just quick detour that cannot last long,
Cuz your dealing with a power that’s supernaturally strong,
And to all you dogs that come sniffing around,
If you don’t come correct with respect you’ll get tied and bound,
And taken to a place that you’ll never be found,
I’m the dog catcher and your going to the pound,
And in my Dog Pound every dog goes to sleep,
So you better think twice if you trying to creep,
So I think that’s all that needs to be said,
I’ve got to go now, somethings hungry,
And I’m starting to see red…

Quicktrader, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:06 am

Still digging for Ross Sullivan clues….This one interested me, but I think the guy is too old, he would have been like 30 years old in 1966, cant see him hanging around college at the library as a 30 year old. Still, he WAS in both RIVERSIDE & SANTA ROSA, which lines up with what the Riverside librarians stated.(although I dont know what years)

Vernon Ross Sullivan
Vernon Ross Sullivan, age 72, of Brainerd, died at his home Friday, Aug. 7, 2009. Services for Ross will be 1 p.m. Thursday, Aug. 13 at Bethany Samaritan Village Chapel with Pastor Lilja Behr officiating. Friends are welcome to visit Wednesday evening from 5-7 p.m. at the Brenny Funeral Chapel in Baxter and one hour prior to services at Bethany on Thursday. Interment will follow at Evergreen Memorial Gardens Cemetery in Brainerd, Minn.

Ross was born Oct. 6, 1936, in Carson City, Nev., to Robert John and Lillian (Root) Sullivan. Raised and educated in Rio Linda, Calif., he was a graduate of Grant Union High School and Moler College. He served in the Army National Guard in New Jersey and in the Reserves in California. He was employed by Blue Chip Stamp in Richmond, Calif.; Frontier Electric in Santa Rosa, Calif.; ARA Group Transportation in Riverside, Calif.; and BFI Waste Systems North America in Omaha, Neb., and Minneapolis, Minn. Ross retired in 1998 and moved to his cabin on North Long Lake. He worked after retirement for Mills Motors and CarQuest Auto Parts. Ross was a fun guy and enjoyed boating, riding his Harley, ATVs, snowmobiles and "golf cart." Ross was an avid drag racing fan and traveled to numerous race tracks throughout the country.

Ross is survived by wife, Gigi; daughter, Lori Bottenfield of Chaska, Minn.; son, Jerry Lee, of Chico, Calif.; daughter, Serena Sullivan of Beaumont, Calif.; sister Genelle (Frank) Palmer of Sacramento, Calif.; brother, Tim (Chery) Dwyer of Galt, Calif.; sister-in-law, Kathy Sullivan, of Hayden, Ind.; brother-in-law, James Arrington of Santa Rosa, Calif.; grandchildren, Dustin Ross (Jaime) Oldenburg of Waconia, Minn., Clayton Lee of Chico, Calif., Blair, Bailey and Brieann Bottenfield of Chaska, Minn., and Jimmy Cox of Beaumont, Calif.; and one great-granddaughter, Hailey Joyce Oldenburg. He was preceded in death by his parents; step-father, Gene Dwyer; and brother, Robert Wayne Sullivan.

Memorials are preferred to Bethany Good Samaritan Garden Fund.

Success has nothing to do with what you gain in life of accomplish for yourself It’s what you do for others. We love you and miss you.

Arrangements have been entrusted to the Brenny Funeral Chapel of Baxter..

Think its a good idea to search for the racers..too obvious the event in Riverside during CJB’s murder.

QT

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:40 am

And what about the letters 30 days and 6 months after the murder? We’re their races going on then too?

Quicktrader, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:58 am

And what about the letters 30 days and 6 months after the murder? We’re their races going on then too?

Good point – it deserves an answer:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1967_Unite … hip_season

In this forum, a guy called ‘strupgolf’ mentions the ‘Timex’ brand of watches in connection with car races, too..of course a car race driver needs some quality watch..and of course, Timex was a brand of race stop watches – there even were ‘Timex’ races:

http://www.racingsportscars.com/photo/R … 04-30.html
http://www.jagpromotions.com/driver/driver.htm

If Timex was providing car races with their time technology, no wonder that some drivers had used Timex watches, too..

Riverside car races have been quite ‘hip’ in 1966…even various movies used it as a scene – mainly in 1966 – such as ‘The killers’ (last Ronald Reagon movie), http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Killers_(1964_film ) , ‘Speedway’, ‘Grand Prix’ or ‘Fireball 500’.

There also was a ‘Frank Sinatra Timex show’ later his daughter Nancy went out with Elvis Presley (movie Speedway)…how romantic.. http://www.elvispresleypedia.com/epedia/film/27e.htm

So apparently both, Riverside speedway as well as Timex was an issue in 1966 (besides ‘meatball’ Elvis Fat Presley )

And hold on: There exists a later-founded ‘Timex Performance Center’ in Albany, where the 1973 Times Union letter was sent from, too..

QT

sandy betts, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:22 pm

I can check the names for Vallejo speedway, I still have a speedway book from the late 60’s. If this guy liked to race, he may have raced at Vallejo? I feel pretty confident that he had a strong Vallejo connection. He was too comfortable with his murders in Vallejo and Benicia, to not have a connection there .

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:49 am

Here’s a possibility:

G** ROSS SULLIVAN
Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz

In 1969, he is in Vallejo directory as living at…..

2500 SPrings Rd….isnt that close to where Z called from after BRS????

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:25 am

WOW! Just found a pic of this guy,and he DOES LOOK ALOT like the Zodiac sketch…..wow

patinky, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:30 am

WOW! Just found a pic of this guy,and he DOES LOOK ALOT like the Zodiac sketch…..wow

Okay, Morf. Quit messing with my mind.

Can you post or PM the picture. TIA

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:34 am

WOW! Just found a pic of this guy,and he DOES LOOK ALOT like the Zodiac sketch…..wow

Okay, Morf. Quit messing with my mind.

Can you post or PM the picture. TIA

At work, will try to see if I can get on a computer that I can send pics from

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:44 am

Again, not sure if this guy is the right Ross Sullivan from the Bates case, I just know this guys middle name IS ROSS, he looks very similar to the Z sketch, and he lived on Springs Rd in Vallejo in 1969.

sandy betts, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:51 am

Here’s a possibility:

G** ROSS SULLIVAN
Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz

In 1969, he is in Vallejo directory as living at…..

2500 SPrings Rd….isnt that close to where Z called from after BRS????

Well this is one for the books , Ross lived where one of my suspects lived ! 2500 Springs road is a trailer park , I have been there. Its not too far from where the call was made.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:17 pm

Just realized I found the same Ross Sullivan that Foreigner found, at least we have a pic of him,looks like the z sketch, but not fat looking As Ross Sullivan in the Bates case may have been

Luke68, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:39 pm

Here’s a possibility:

G** ROSS SULLIVAN
Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz

In 1969, he is in Vallejo directory as living at…..

2500 SPrings Rd….isnt that close to where Z called from after BRS????

There are two parts to Springs Road in Vallejo. 2500 is (was?) a trailer park. This is the Springs Road that becomes Solano Avenue. the Springs Road with the pay phone is still close – distance by car is 1.5 miles.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:43 pm

Here’s a possibility:

G** ROSS SULLIVAN
Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz

In 1969, he is in Vallejo directory as living at…..

2500 SPrings Rd….isnt that close to where Z called from after BRS????

There are two parts to Springs Road in Vallejo. 2500 is (was?) a trailer park. This is the Springs Road that becomes Solano Avenue. the Springs Road with the pay phone is still close – distance by car is 1.5 miles.

Yeah, the phone was at Springs & Tulomne/Tuolomne(spelled wrong I am sure)

In the 1970 Directory, he has moved to 735 Georgia St

Luke68, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:52 pm

Just realized I found the same Ross Sullivan that Foreigner found, at least we have a pic of him,looks like the z sketch, but not fat looking As Ross Sullivan in the Bates case may have been

Morf, are you referring to a 1962 year book photo? I found one of Gerald Sullivan. Not sure it’s the same one though.

Theforeigner, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:02 pm

Here’s a possibility:

G** ROSS SULLIVAN
Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz

In 1969, he is in Vallejo directory as living at…..

2500 SPrings Rd….isnt that close to where Z called from after BRS????

Hi Morf

Di you read my post about this, G** ROSS SULLIVAN Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz man on page #3, ca.4 posts prior to yours? there is some more info on him and his relatives.

Could you please PM me your picture of him? I could not find any photos, except one, on one of his relatives facebook, but that photo is a very recent photo of him, very heavy and all red in his face, didn’t look anything like the Zodiac sketch.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:13 pm

Here’s a possibility:

G** ROSS SULLIVAN
Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz

In 1969, he is in Vallejo directory as living at…..

2500 SPrings Rd….isnt that close to where Z called from after BRS????

Hi Morf

Di you read my post about this, G** ROSS SULLIVAN Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz man on page #3, ca.4 posts prior to yours? there is some more info on him and his relatives.

Could you please PM me your picture of him? I could not find any photos, except one, on one of his relatives facebook, but that photo is a very recent photo of him, very heavy and all red in his face, didn’t look anything like the Zodiac sketch.

Here is the pic from 1962 Yearbook(thanks to Patinky for putting this photo together):

I want to be clear,we are not accusing this guy of any crimes,just merely trying to determine if he is the same Ross Sullivan from the RCC campus

Theforeigner, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:28 pm

Again, not sure if this guy is the right Ross Sullivan from the Bates case, I just know this guys middle name IS ROSS, he looks very similar to the Z sketch, and he lived on Briggs Rd in Vallejo in 1969.

Are you sure about the "Briggs Rd in Vallejo in 1969" address? bc I cant find that street in vallejo on google map, however there is a Briggs Street in Daly City, CA.

IF he in fact lived in daly City, this is of possible interest.

Jan 1974, 1 phonecalls was made from Daly City, the called claimed to be Zodiac:

January 12, 1974, Daly City newsreport says (summary found at zk.com):

A caller (to the police department, I believe) claiming to be Zodiac says that he killed a woman and dumped her body in a Daly City church. Area churches were searched, but nothing was found.

And Melvin Belli made some arrangement to meet with Zodiac in Daly City:

At 2 a.m. on October 22, 1969, someone claiming to be the Zodiac called Oakland PD demanding that one of two prominent lawyers, F. Lee Bailey or Melvin Belli, appear on Jim Dunbar’s television talk show in the morning.
At some point Belli agreed to meet with him in Daly City, but the suspect never showed up.

I´ll se I can find more info on the Zodiac /daly City issues.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:32 pm

Again, not sure if this guy is the right Ross Sullivan from the Bates case, I just know this guys middle name IS ROSS, he looks very similar to the Z sketch, and he lived on Briggs Rd in Vallejo in 1969.

Are you sure about the "Briggs Rd in Vallejo in 1969" address? bc I cant find that street in vallejo on google map, however there is a Briggs Street in Daly City, CA.

100% sure,I am reading the 1969 Vallejo Directory and it lists him at 2500 Springs Rd Vallejo

Theforeigner, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:34 pm

Again, not sure if this guy is the right Ross Sullivan from the Bates case, I just know this guys middle name IS ROSS, he looks very similar to the Z sketch, and he lived on Briggs Rd in Vallejo in 1969.

Are you sure about the "Briggs Rd in Vallejo in 1969" address? bc I cant find that street in vallejo on google map, however there is a Briggs Street in Daly City, CA.

100% sure,I am reading the 1969 Vallejo Directory and it lists him at 2500 Springs Rd Vallejo

yes I know the 2500 Springs Rd address in vallejo, but I was refering to the Briggs Rd address in Vallejo that you posted

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:38 pm

I am sorry, BRIGGS RD was a typo,it is SPRINGS RD. I didnt find any lstings for him on Briggs,I just corrected my earlier mistake

Theforeigner, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:53 pm

I am sorry, BRIGGS RD was a typo,it is SPRINGS RD. I didnt find any lstings for him on Briggs,I just corrected my earlier mistake

OK thanks

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:24 am

Here’s a possibility:

G** ROSS SULLIVAN
Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz

In 1969, he is in Vallejo directory as living at…..

2500 SPrings Rd….isnt that close to where Z called from after BRS????

Hi Morf

Di you read my post about this, G***** ROSS SULLIVAN Born in 1944 in Santa Cruz man on page #3, ca.4 posts prior to yours? there is some more info on him and his relatives.

Could you please PM me your picture of him? I could not find any photos, except one, on one of his relatives facebook, but that photo is a very recent photo of him, very heavy and all red in his face, didn’t look anything like the Zodiac sketch.

Here is the pic from 1962 Yearbook(thanks to Patinky for putting this photo together):

I want to be clear,we are not accusing this guy of any crimes,just merely trying to determine if he is the same Ross Sullivan from the RCC campus

I have been thinking about this alot, although this guy looks like the Z sketch, and lived in Santa Rosa area, and lived onSprings rd in Vallejo, he may likely NOT be the correct Ross Sullivan from the Bates case. The reason why is a closer look at this:

The librarian states that the corrrect ROSS SULLIVAN first came to RCC in 1961. If this is true & correct, the look alike above, would have only been 16-17 at the time,so he likely cant be the right guy. That would make the ROSS M. SULLIVAN that died in Santa Cruz in 1977, likely the correct person. He would have been 20 years old or so to enter college in RCC in 1961.

Most people start college at 18-19 years old. The correct Ross SUllivan likely would have been born from 1941-1943. This seems like a dead end,but I will continue to check it out. I am awaiting to get the death cert from Ross M. Sullivan that died in 1977. Should tell us the names of his closest relatives,and then we can go from there. Might take a couple weeks to get. For now, seems like we are in a holding pattern

Theforeigner, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:58 pm

You are probably right Morf.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:01 pm

You are probably right Morf.

Back to the drawing board…..Maybe

Luke68, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:41 pm

Yep, this must be a different guy.

One thing I spotted from re-reading the letter:

‘…his term paper was about handwriting and the different styles.’

Has anyone seen the transcript that was attached to the original note?

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:40 pm

Yep, this must be a different guy.

One thing I spotted from re-reading the letter:

‘…his term paper was about handwriting and the different styles.’

Has anyone seen the transcript that was attached to the original note?

I havent. Ask SANDY or Howard Davis

Jem, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:26 am

Interest in different handwriting styles, strange poem about a supervisor that scared this library worker, incarceration in a mental hospital, escaping from the mental hospital and bragging about it, remarking that "he had to write continually to keep from doing harm to himself or others" – no wonder this writer and other staff members so strongly suspected the guy! And disappearing after Cheri Jo’s murder and the prediction about him having new clothes when he came back that turned out to be the case. Really creepy stuff, if true.

The writer could well be right that the person who alibied him did so out of fear. Anyone know what his alibi was or who provided it?

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:30 am

Interest in different handwriting styles, strange poem about a supervisor that scared this library worker, incarceration in a mental hospital, escaping from the mental hospital and bragging about it, remarking that "he had to write continually to keep from doing harm to himself or others" – no wonder this writer and other staff members so strongly suspected the guy! And disappearing after Cheri Jo’s murder and the prediction about him having new clothes when he came back that turned out to be the case. Really creepy stuff, if true.

The writer could well be right that the person who alibied him did so out of fear. Anyone know what his alibi was or who provided it?

JEM< i think the bulk of what is known about Ross Sullivan is right here in this thread, which isn’t a whole lot.

sandy betts, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:05 pm

Yep, this must be a different guy.

One thing I spotted from re-reading the letter:

‘…his term paper was about handwriting and the different styles.’

Has anyone seen the transcript that was attached to the original note?

I havent. Ask SANDY or Howard Davis

I haven’t seen his handwriting, but I will ask Howard. I don’t remember seeing that Ross was ever a suspect with Riverside Pd. They seemed to have blinders on and only concentrated on Bennett, who has been proven not to be her killer by DNA.
I am still curious about the "janitor" who attacked a young girl around that time?

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Thu Nov 29, 2012 5:41 pm

The RCC librarian I believe was very acurate about the Ross Sullivan details, and I believe he WAS the guy that died in Santa Cruz County in 1977..ROSS M. SULLIVAN. I hope we can gather some addl info about this guy based off of his death cert info….

So, what can we gather from this death cert?

*Sullivan was born in 1941 in NY

*Sullivan’s Dad was Harold Sullivan, born in CT, and his Mom was Harriet Sullivan (maiden name Gray)born in Maine, I think this is his Mom’s info(matches up perfect)-
Name: Harriet G Sullivan
[Harriet G Gray]
Social Security #: 141243803
Gender: Female
Birth Date: 6 Jul 1916
Birth Place: Maine
Death Date: 12 Sep 1959
Death Place: Los Angeles
Mother’s Maiden Name: Keith
Father’s Surname: Gray

I believe his dad was HAROLD M. SULLIVAN and that they lived in the Rochester, NY area in the early 40’s

*Also, the person that found the body was named John Sullivan, likely his Brother. There were a couple John Sullivans listed in the 1969 Vallejo Directory, one at 163B…..? & one at 96 Cypress Ave. In 1977, when he found Ross dead, John’s address was 1929 B Russell St Berkeley, and Ross was living at 2177 17th ave in Santa Cruz

*Ross had a menial dead end type of job(dishwasher)despite going to college

*Ross was ‘OBESE’ (stocky, fat, perhaps like Z?), and appeared to have died of natural causes…ironic, he died on the 8 year anniversary of Cecelia Shepard’s death.

*At the time of his mom’s death in 1959, the Family lived in Los Angeles area, which lines up again perfectly with the Librarian’s statement:

So, now we have some clues to go on….anybody that can post more info about Ross, or especially finds a photo of him, will earn my unending gratitude :cheers:

sandy betts, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:26 pm

Good work Morf, Pickwickian syndrome is due to obesity ( That is way more than just fat, much larger than Art Allen) Zodiac was seen as stalky but not fat.
Right Ventricular failure is heart failure, probably due to his extreme obesity.
I have heard of obese and overly obese, but extreme obese is huge !

Is there any chance that Ross went back to Riverside ? There was a Ross Michael Sullivan who died in Riverside in 2008.

morf13, Subject: Re: Riverside City College Library picks their best Bates suspect Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:45 pm

Sandy, I am pretty sure I have the right guy…the librarian said he was a "huge guy". Plus, I an find zero records of ANY Ross Sullivans that died in Riverside in 2008