Since this thread is very active I just wanted to post that I just drove to Washington & Cherry Street for the very first time and it’s much smaller than any movie or picture perception. Those kids who saw the crime were up extremely close, it’s basically like looking out your front window and seeing what’s happening on your own sidewalk.

Have Those kids ever seen pictures of the known suspects ?

Hi Gunya,

You might find what you seek here: viewtopic.php?f=30&t=401

If you post in any thread, it will make that section active.

I think I follow what you are saying, correct me I am wrong, so you think Zodiac, picked an obscure crime at the RCC Library 3 years before his crimes, and 6 hours south to copy? If so, why didn’t Z take credit for the RCC crime immediately and seize on all the attention once Avery published the connection? Instead, he waited months before responding. If he wanted to take credit for it, he would have taken advantage of it while it was fresh in the papers,not months later, which I think is what somebody would do who’s nervous that a big clue to their identity & background has been discovered,and waits months before he takes credit after he feels that his arrest is not imminent

I’m not following you. The guy reads the papers, he reads about CJB, Manson, and other murder cases, and the sick nature of the confession letter happens to catch his eye. Something about the idea of killing someone and claiming credit publicly must’ve appealed to him, as that was what the whole Z persona was about.

I don’t think the CJB case, and its grisly confession letter, would be considered obscure to a person like Z. To the contrary I think that kind of thing is exactly what would’ve caught his attention, in a big way.

To your point, I don’t see what that has to do with taking credit/ not taking credit for Riverside. He quoted from The Mikado too, for instance, because it must’ve appealed to him.

As far as we know, PH is his grand finale, possibly because of the very close call, and the witness descriptions and sketch. Only after that, when he’s presumably too afraid to actually commit another Z murder, does he take credit for Kathleen Johns and "Riverside Activity," and it could very well be that his reason for doing so was to throw LE onto the wrong track.

Then it’s the world’s greatest coincidence that his writing later becomes linked to her case I guess

A reproduction was published in 1968.

You can view the article here:

http://www.zodiackiller.com/InsideDetective3.html

When the reporter re-wrote it, the correct spellings were used, but noted there were several misspelled words. I cannot speak for the one reproduced as it is blurry, but I think I know someone who can.

Thanks!

I find it very interesting that the newspaper corrected the spelling errors.

O.k., so it is possible that Zodiac, living in the Bay Area, read this article, saved it, killed some people a couple of years later, and then, after writing about a dozen letters, includes some of the same words because he liked to copy stuff, and coincidentally, misspelled with "twich" the exact same way that the author of the Confession Letter misspelled with "twich," even though the newpaper corrected the spelling! But it is highly improbable.

It is far more likely that it was the same dude.

You left out how his writing also was miraculously linked to the Bates case writing to boot

A reproduction was published in 1968.

You can view the article here:

http://www.zodiackiller.com/InsideDetective3.html

When the reporter re-wrote it, the correct spellings were used, but noted there were several misspelled words. I cannot speak for the one reproduced as it is blurry, but I think I know someone who can.

Thanks!

I find it very interesting that the newspaper corrected the spelling errors.

O.k., so it is possible that Zodiac, living in the Bay Area, read this article, saved it, killed some people a couple of years later, and then, after writing about a dozen letters, includes some of the same words because he liked to copy stuff, and coincidentally, misspelled with "twich" the exact same way that the author of the Confession Letter misspelled with "twich," even though the newpaper corrected the spelling! But it is highly improbable.

It is far more likely that it was the same dude.

I don’t know…

If Zodiac was into quoting and/or using other writings, etc., it would not surprise me if he copied the tone of the Confession letter.

This was in a magazine. True Detective. Sick stuff in those magazines and could be something Zodiac looked at regularly.

Also, if you take other things into consideration, there is a lot more that is NOT like Zodiac. Talking about her breast feeling warm? Focused on girls. Why did this not continue, but the similar tone did?

Psychos admire other psychos.

Do you leave open the possibility that Z was simply the Author of said writings?

Do you leave open the possibility that Z was simply the Author of said writings?

I don’t speak for Tahoe, but I certainly leave open the possibility, because there are certain things that do seem strangely coincidental. I just don’t think sufficient evidence has shown it yet, and it just remains strangely coincidental.

You left out how his writing also was miraculously linked to the Bates case writing to boot

Was it miraculously linked? Morrill knew going in what he was looking at/for when he began his analysis.

***

There are lots of possibilities. Sure, Zodiac could be responsible. I just disclose what was out there. Paul_A said the confession letter was not published until years after the Riverside connection. But it was, and If Zodiac liked to copy things (and it appears he did) that shows it was possible..for what it’s worth.

I definetly agree there is a damn good possibility riverside is ground zero…z did point out toschi was good at his job and tieing in his activities down there..do we trust z to gave spoken the truth about this or not..personally i dont unless information provided is verified by me….i also think z had no past contacts ever with stine and went right into toshi’s front yard so to speak to send a message..ross is an interesting character but even more so because little is really know…i want ross’s alibi in regards to bates..no there is not enuff evidence to ever convict ross….going to need something that can be used in court and as of now that just ain’t reality..really kewl stuff though in this thread..good read…

Well obviously Zodiac read that obscure magazine and copied the word twitch, misspelled it just like the real confession, even though the reproduction he copied was spelled correctly. Must have gotten lucky.

How did he also know to copy the double postage?

How about copying the handwriting?
http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtop … 397&p=1289

Funny, I can see here that it looks the same. The copycat obviously based it on the desktop poem, but where did he read about that before the connection was made?

It would be more probable that the Riverside writer and the Zodiac writings were completely unrelated than Zodiac copying Riverside evidence in the very low chance LE would incorrectly connect it.

It would be more probable that the Riverside writer and the Zodiac writings were completely unrelated than Zodiac copying Riverside evidence in the very low chance LE would incorrectly connect it.

I agree.

Well obviously Zodiac read that obscure magazine and copied the word twitch, misspelled it just like the real confession, even though the reproduction he copied was spelled correctly. Must have gotten lucky.

How did he also know to copy the double postage?

How about copying the handwriting?
http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtop … 397&p=1289

Funny, I can see here that it looks the same. The copycat obviously based it on the desktop poem, but where did he read about that before the connection was made?

It would be more probable that the Riverside writer and the Zodiac writings were completely unrelated than Zodiac copying Riverside evidence in the very low chance LE would incorrectly connect it.

Might be nice to have you acknowledge your error after (having posted twice to Marshall) about the confession letter not having been published, as you say, until years after the Riverside connection. Instead you come back with sarcasm, but….whatever.

You need to go back and read. That "obscure magazine" got the reproduction from the newspaper in Riverside. And, the reproduction did NOT spell twitched correctly.

***

ONE stamp would not have been sufficient postage when it came to the Bates letters. The sender had to put two.

The only thing that bears any resemblance to Zodiac’s handwriting is in the envelopes. Even those are probably similar to 90% of the POI’s writing samples and probably a good portion of the students at RHS or RCC.

I have said for years I thought it possible Zodiac could have written the letters. Of course it’s possible! I just think he got off claiming things he didn’t do, or like Marshall states…it throws LE off track. Just like what he did with Kathleen Johns, who by the way, didn’t seem to be describing Ross Sullivan. I say this because if one likes Ross as a suspect, than Zodiac’s letter claiming KJ shows he took credit for crimes he didn’t commit.

Usually criminals dont crap where they live..may be z in fact did…sending the here i am come and get me signals in san fran area was a far cry from his home base which may have possibly been riverside…but yea its all conjecture and we can arm chair quarterback it if and or when z is ever caught…z would not have liked toschi poking around in riverside for obvious reasons..everybody could identify him and knew him..san fran area not so much…of couese all my take here

Yea good point on KJ…IF, IF, IF you think she was with or not with the Z would depend on how one views her description..personally i am biased here and beluive kj was very possibly right next to the z…

So where does 14 pages leave us..right back to the only poi that can conclusive be tied to riverside and thats ross..ross has as much going for him as tk, x, gaik, ala and the rest of the lot in regards to proof of being z which really is not much proof in the eyes of any states attorney….but if you toss out cjb then the others become much more interesting in the greater z world..

ONE stamp would not have been sufficient postage when it came to the Bates letters. The sender had to put two.

Sure he did.

I’ve asked this before, create a thread about your Zodiac copycat "theory," post evidence that supports it, and watch members blast holes through it.

The smallest, most impractical path for a bay area killer to learn of, and copy elements of a crime, is not proof or even a good reason to think a copycat is even a good possibility.

Know what is a good possibility? A mentally ill individual who matches the Z physical description, and had ties to both areas in the years the crimes took place.

Really, that is your reply to my post? Typical.

I guess he could have put three stamps or used different stamps, but the ones he used…he needed two. If I’m mistaken, I will gladly acknowledge it and admit my mistake.

I have posted about what I think about Lake Berryessa. Sure, some disagree and some agree. I am not looking to score points. The rest of it…I don’t think there was a "copycat" and I certainly have no theory of one. I think Zodiac was the one who, at times, was full of sh**.

ONE stamp would not have been sufficient postage when it came to the Bates letters. The sender had to put two.

Sure he did.

That’s very dismissive of a fact. If he was, in fact, required to use two stamps, then it does the epitome of a coincidence. If he needs to use two stamps, he has to use two stamps. Retorting "sure he did" is not a very good way to dispute facts.

The smallest, most impractical path for a bay area killer to learn of, and copy elements of a crime, is not proof or even a good reason to think a copycat is even a good possibility.

I agree. It is impractical (still possible, but I agree not very probable) for that to be the steps taken. However, on this same notion, you cannot link minute coincidences together and then conclude it was the same person, also. There were many crazy people doing many crazy violent acts and crazy seeks for attention in Southern California and the whole west coast during this time period. If we had no suspects in many of the murders, one could be compelled to link many different serial killer murders together to the same individual due to the strange matter involving the cases.

Sometimes craziness abets craziness.

Know what is a good possibility? A mentally ill individual who matches the Z physical description, and had ties to both areas in the years the crimes took place.

I again agree! It is a possibility. It is not a fact, though, and it isn’t even a strong likelihood given the evidence presented. With more information coming out, the scales could tip either way, but as the current facts stand, it is irresponsible to conclude the two must be from one individual. That’s all that I’m wanting people to acknowledge.

I guess he could have put three stamps or used different stamps, but the ones he used…he needed two.

He could have used 3 or 4 or even none, like the confession. But he just so happened to use the exact amount that later became a common trait of the Zodiac letters.

But as always, it’s explained away as a big coincidence! Just admit that if photos of the Bates letters with double postage appeared in the papers before 1969, you would claim he copied the double postage. I guess the Riverside writer was just concerned with proper postage….. but not for the confession letter.