Good. So what’s the game plan at this point?

Soze

I think we agree that the Zip/postal codes are now correct ?

We still are unsure what the letter after the postal Zone denotes ?

The ones that confuse me are the 6’s, if they are Postboxes as believed, how does an outgoing letter have this postmark. I know this side of the pond that PO Boxes are only used for incoming mail ? You can not send an item from a PO Box, is this the same in US, or would a business who used a PO Bo’s outgoing mail be also stamped with a 6 ?

The letters with 4/6’s were all posted from a relatively small area in SF so it would logical to assume that Z had some sort of affiliation with the Rincon area. Also this would explain how the 2nd letter as Richard believed was hand delivered to the paper.

Personally I still believe that he drove to the Richmond area and then commuted into the Rincon area via the street car.

I’m going to look into which letters were sent from where to see if there is anything interesting, (i.e. these hand delivered letter was obviously rushed to paper as a directly reply to LE stating that they needed more info from Z to prove that he was the murderer). Are there any other examples where this takes place ?

Also PG&E needs a closer look as there seems to be quite a few coincidences with Z.

Lastly the hand cancellations on the letters, the writing on the envelope of both of these was so different than usual and the fact they were hand cancelled leads me to believe that they were posted at an actual Post Office and not a mailbox ?

What’s your thoughts on what needs to be looked at Soze ?

Good. So what’s the game plan at this point?

Soze

I think we agree that the Zip/postal codes are now correct ?

We still are unsure what the letter after the postal Zone denotes ?

The ones that confuse me are the 6’s, if they are Postboxes as believed, how does an outgoing letter have this postmark. I know this side of the pond that PO Boxes are only used for incoming mail ? You can not send an item from a PO Box, is this the same in US, or would a business who used a PO Bo’s outgoing mail be also stamped with a 6 ?

The letters with 4/6’s were all posted from a relatively small area in SF so it would logical to assume that Z had some sort of affiliation with the Rincon area. Also this would explain how the 2nd letter as Richard believed was hand delivered to the paper.

Personally I still believe that he drove to the Richmond area and then commuted into the Rincon area via the street car.

I’m going to look into which letters were sent from where to see if there is anything interesting, (i.e. these hand delivered letter was obviously rushed to paper as a directly reply to LE stating that they needed more info from Z to prove that he was the murderer). Are there any other examples where this takes place ?

Also PG&E needs a closer look as there seems to be quite a few coincidences with Z.

Lastly the hand cancellations on the letters, the writing on the envelope of both of these was so different than usual and the fact they were hand cancelled leads me to believe that they were posted at an actual Post Office and not a mailbox ?

What’s your thoughts on what needs to be looked at Soze ?

The letters denote districts. Here is a complete map (scroll to bottom of page)

http://www.sforelo.com/neighborhoods.html

1a Central Richmond
1b Inner Richmond
1c Jordan Park, Laurel Heights
1d Lake
1e Outer Richmond
1f Sea Cliff
1g Lone Mountain
2a Golden Gate Heights
2b Outer Parkside
2c Outer Sunset
2d Parkside
2e Central Sunset
2f Inner Sunset
2g Inner Parkside
3a Lake Shore
3b Merced Heights
3c Pine Lake Park
3d Stonestown
3e Lakeside
3f Merced Manor
3g Ingleside Heights
3h Ingleside
3j Oceanview
4a Balboa Terrace
4b Diamond Heights
4c Forest Hills
4d Forest Knolls
4e Ingleside Terrace
4f Midtown Terrace
4g St. Francis Wood
4h Miraloma Park
4j Forest Hill Extension
4k Sherwood Forest
4m Monterey Heights
4n Mount Davidson Manor
4p Westwood Highlands
4r Westwood Park
4s Sunnyside
4t West Portal
5a Glen Park
5b Haight Ashbury
5c Noe Valley
5d Twin Peaks
5e Cole Valley/Parnassus Heights
5f Buena Vista Park/Asbury Heights
5g Corona Heights
5h Clarendon Heights
5j Duboce Triangle
5k Eureka Valley, Dolores Heights
5m Mission Dolores
6a Anza Vista
6b Hayes Valley
6c Lower Pacific Heights
6d Western Addition
6e Alamo Square
6f North Panhandle
7a Marina
7b Pacific Heights
7c Presidio Heights
7d Cow Hollow
8a Downtown
8b Financial District
8c Nob Hill
8d North Beach
8e Russian Hill
8f Van Ness, Civic Center
8g Telegraph Hill
8h North Waterfront
8j Tenderloin
9a Bernal Heights
9c Inner Mission
9d Mission Bay
9e Potrero Hill
9f South of Market
9g Yerba Buena
9h South Beach
9j Central Waterfront/Dogpatch
10a Bayview
10b Crocker Amazon
10c Excelsior
10d Outer Mission
10e Visitacion Valley
10f Portola
10g Silver Terrace
10h Mission Terrace
10j Hunter’s Point
10k Bayview Heights
10m Candlestick Point
10n Little Hollywood

Unfortunately Richard this is not the case, if you look at the link you attached the letters and numbers you refer to (3rd List on page) are the planning departments districts and not the postal zones.

District 4 on the Realtor map shows :-

4a Balboa Terrace, 4b Diamond Heights, 4c Forest Hills, 4d Forest Knolls etc.

Whilst the 4 Postal zone (94104) is Financial District.

This is the trap we fell it to before.

This is the latest map I made.

I think it throws up some interesting points:-

1. Initially Z seems to concentrate on the Richmond area until the Stine attack. After the Stine letter and his subsiquent sketch being distrubted only 1 more letter is posted from this area and that is the Button/Map letter on the 26/06/1970. This letter’s envelope is very neatly written. Only contains 1 stamp and does not have "Rush to Editor", the Crosshair logo or any other distingusing features.

2. The later letters seem to be mailed from the East side of the city.

3. The Four letters with 4 or 6 postmarks (94104, 94106) were all posted on weekdays, with the exception of the "My Name is" letter which has a Saturday AM postmark. So this begs the question was this also mailed on a weekday (Friday) but after the post had been collected thus meaning that it was collect the day after is was sent i.e. Saturday. This would lend weight to the idea that Z perhaps worked around the Rincon / FinanciaL District.

4. The Code Key letter was sent from 3 (94103) which is next to the 4,6 district and in some cases seems to overlap on the 6. So this does beg the question could this has actually been from Z.

5. The First two hand cancelled letters have a completely different style of writing on both, this along with the hand cancellation perhaps means that these were posted at a Post Office as opposed to a mailbox. The different handwriting to maybe throw off any eagle eyed Mail employee who would regonise his usual print. On the other hand the amount of stamps used could counter this arguement although the use of 6 stamps on the Belli letter was maybe due to the proximity of Christmas to the mailing.
Also the Bus Bomb letter is the only one that is sent on a Wednesday. This is interesting in itself as the day before, the dripping pen letter had been sent from 4 (94104). Then the Bus Bomb letter is hand cancelled and not from the same location. Could this perhaps indiacte that he did not work on a Wednesday and this was sent from near his home ?
Of the hand cancelled letters the they posted in order of Wednesday, Saturday & Sunday. The only other letter posted on a weekend was the above "My Name is" which as speculated could have been posted on a Friday.

6. His attack on Stine actually correlates with his Letter sending. He Gets in a taxi by the 94104/94106 area and murders Paul Stine in the Richmond area where his initial volley of letters is sent from.

7. There are 3 pair of letters which were posted within the same month.

November 1969 – "Dripping Pen Card" & "Bus Bomb". 1 Day Apart – Tuesday 94104 Area then Wednesday Cancellation
Z in Financial District on the Tuesday and then possibly home on the Wednesday.

April 1970 – "My Name is" & "Dragon Card". 8 Days Apart – Saturday 94104 Area then Tuesday only H visible

July 1970 – "John’s Letter" & "Little List". 3 Days Apart – Friday 94106 Area then Sunday Hand Cancellation
Z in Financial District on the Friday and then possibly home on the Sunday.

The "Dragon Card’s" postmark is unreadable, a H can be made out but no number. This shows though that this was sent from a different location from ANY of the other letters, I think that perhaps this one could be the most significant, it would very interesting to know which Zone this was posted from. It was sent 8 days after the "My Name is" letter.

8. As Richard Theorises the it would make perfect sense that the "Zodia Unveiled" letter was hand delivered as from the above map you can see that Z frequented the area around the SFC.

9. The Number of stamps used obviously differs:-

408 Cipher 2 on both SFE & SFC, 4 on VTH. He obviously used 4 on the VTH to try to ensure that it arrived at the same time as the other two.
Paul Stine Letter 2 Stamps
Dripping Pen 2 Stamps
Bus Bomb 2 Stamps
Belli Letter 6 Stamps (Possibly due to the proximity of Christmas and Z wanting it arrive before then)
My Name Is 2 Stamps
Dragon Card 2 Stamps

At this point he is obviously aware that postal employees are looking for letters with overpostage applied.

Button Letter 1 Stamp
John’s Letter 1 Stamp
Little List 1 Stamp
Halloween Card 1 Stamp

Yes, great work. There is certainly a pattern centered on the east and west, indicating that if he lived in Vallejo, he may have entered via the Golden Gate Bridge, passed the Richmond area and headed to the financial district. Have you considered doing rudimentary geographic profiling to analyze his likely place of work (assuming he lived in Vallejo and worked in San Francisco). Or quite possibly ignoring Vallejo altogether.

I once made a crude map of the west side of San Francisco, not only focusing on the Stine murder and Richmond mailings, but the contents of the letters themselves, which heavily centered on the Radetich shooting, the Park Police Station bombing and the Dragon Card (Don Quixote and Sancho Panza) – These characters are situated only 3,650 feet (0.68 miles) from the murder site of Sgt. Brian McDonnell, both of which are situated in Golden Gate Park.

I know Zodiac was likely not responsible for Radetich and McDonnell, but his focus in several 1970 mailings were. Anyway, brilliant work everybody concerned.

I apologize, as I have not been keeping up lately (new job, yadda, yadda). Is the newest postal information consistent with someone living in/near Oakland and working on the Presidio?

I don’t know if I’ve posted this before (and I’m sure it’s been posted somewhere, by someone), but I am convinced tha Z worked at Letterman Army Hospital. If he worked 11 p-7 a, then he could shoot Stine and walk to work. This was the easiest way to avoid the problem of getting away from the police search. No cars or escape routes or witnesses to worry about. Further, if he worked around patients, the presence of blood on him or his clothing might not be seen as too unusual.

I apologize, as I have not been keeping up lately (new job, yadda, yadda). Is the newest postal information consistent with someone living in/near Oakland and working on the Presidio?

I don’t know if I’ve posted this before (and I’m sure it’s been posted somewhere, by someone), but I am convinced tha Z worked at Letterman Army Hospital. If he worked 11 p-7 a, then he could shoot Stine and walk to work. This was the easiest way to avoid the problem of getting away from the police search. No cars or escape routes or witnesses to worry about. Further, if he worked around patients, the presence of blood on him or his clothing might not be seen as too unusual.

It’s certainly not inconsistent with Oakland and the Letterman. I always come back to the BRS payphone. Why not make the call to Vallejo PD somewhere between Vallejo and Oakland in relative safety, rather than spending 40 minutes around Vallejo. The same applies to San Francisco, Napa, Sacramento etc. But no, Oakland cannot be ruled out.

<There is certainly a pattern centered on the east and west, indicating that if he lived in Vallejo, he may have entered via the Golden Gate Bridge, passed the Richmond area and headed to the financial district.>

One point though — if he lived in Vallejo he typically would have taken Highway 80 and the Bay Bridge into San Francisco, as opposed to the Golden Gate Bridge.

He would have taken the Golden Gate Bridge if he lived in Marin County — or Sonoma County towns such as Petaluma or Santa Rosa.

Irrespective of which bridge he used, I tend to believe he chose the Stine murder location because of his familiarity with this location. Whether he worked in the area around or near to the Presidio Park is another matter entirely.

Cragle,

I am of the opinion that we need to determine what mailing districts the zodiac had contact with. I then believe we need a list of every street within the districts mentioned and every residence/business for each street. A cross reference from district to district made afterwards. A list of the streets of the time wouldn’t be hard for any one of us. A list of the businesses/residence for each street would be easier for someone living in SF as they can go to a library and obtain the information on a street by street basis. Outside of living in SF the only other option would be to go through phone book. Not impossible but time consuming. A look into each name/business done and then a cross reference to other mailing districts mentioned. No idea how fruitful this would be.

Soze

I am of the opinion that we need to determine what mailing districts the zodiac had contact with. I then believe we need a list of every street within the districts mentioned and every residence/business for each street. A cross reference from district to district made afterwards. A list of the streets of the time wouldn’t be hard for any one of us. A list of the businesses/residence for each street would be easier for someone living in SF as they can go to a library and obtain the information on a street by street basis. Outside of living in SF the only other option would be to go through phone book. Not impossible but time consuming. A look into each name/business done and then a cross reference to other mailing districts mentioned. No idea how fruitful this would be.

I am sure that I am probably not going to be saying anything you don’t know already, so apologies if that is the case. I have, however, spent a good while reading through the whole of this this thread to try and catch up.

Given that a list could be compiled as to "what mailing districts the zodiac had contact with," as you say it shouldn’t then be difficult to list all the streets within the districts. Then, take for example a couple of the businesses that brubaker gave in an earlier post as being on Market Street:

Here are some businesses in the "Rincon Caller" ZIP code (94106):

Pacific Gas & Electric
245 Market Street

Greyhound Amazing America Vacations
369 Market Street

The San Francisco Directories could be used to expand this list by street, such as here for Market St.

It would be a lot of work, but doing it by street in this way would help reduced this. Then there is a further benefit from this that I am, myself, looking at at the moment.

Take brubaker’s listing for ‘Greyhound Amazing America Vacations,’ 369 Market Street, San Francisco. Here’s the relevant entry from the 1969/70 San Francisco City Directory, confirming it is on Market Street in a potentially significant postal district.

But then, just today I had been going through the Vallejo City Directory for 1968/9, and pulling out some individuals that I had been otherwise interested in (for reasons I won’t go into here, but in part stemming from Rossmo’s geoprofile), and came up with the following two:

Caldwell, Andrew (w. Claretta) Emp Greyhound H406 Illinois St Apt 3
Cutting, Arthur (w. Mary) Driver Greyhound H758A Sheridan St

As you will understand, from the connection to the business location in San Fran, I am at least a little bit more interested in wanting to find out more about these guys specifically.

So – and I guess this is the (to me, encouraging) point from all of this – with a list of businesses in the interesting postal districts of San Francisco, coupled with directories for key GeoProfile areas, such as Vallejo and American Canyon, it would be possible to do a wider cross-referencing that could be really narrowing in terms of subset of individuals (living in, say, Vallejo; working in San Fran).

Just my thoughts, coming as they have merely from the coincidence of what I have been working on, and reading, just today.

When I said library I was thinking about the images you provided but wasn’t thinking (don’t ask me why) that they would be in the back of the darn phone book. Iol. I have missed placed 69′ but have 68 and the others and it’s at the back.

Y’all do what you want but I like tackling one thing at a time and be thorough on each one. I’m sticking with San Francisco until I’m satisfied I’ve covered everything before moving on.

Soze

Sorry, I’m loosely following it — is the purpose to establish which businesses were located close to the various mailboxes?

If so, that seems like a long shot, unless multiple letters were mailed from the same box. In reality, weren’t the letters mailed from various mailboxes all over the city?

And to connect two guys who lived in Vallejo and worked for Greyhound, because a letter was mailed near a Greyhound travel office in San Francisco?

Hmm . . .

(Also back then, the Greyhound depot — which would be the SF headquarters — was located at 6th and Market streets. That’s where drivers and most employees would go to work, if they were based out of San Francisco.)

I probably need to clarify a couple of things in regard to my previous post which – and this is perhaps the most important clarification – was certainly not intended to be suggesting any deviation from the excellent work that is going on in this thread, nor how it is undertaken. I suppose, if anything, I was just thinking out loud about the future direction of where this work might subsequently be useful.

I may have misunderstood the broad purpose of what you are doing here, but had assumed that it relates back to the OP:

Do we know where each letter/card/cipher was mailed from? I know they were mailed from the city, but I mean do we know the specific mailbox locations each correspondence was sent? If so, has Kim Rossmo considered this in his geo profiling?

Essentially, I had assumed that it was about somehow extending Rossmo’s GeoProfile to consider what patterns as to the mailings of the various letters in San Francisco could say about the killer’s movements there.

Having not sensed that this ‘extension’ was about rewriting the profile – Rossmo, of course, had excluded the possibility of the killer living in San Francisco – I had further seen the more recent focus of this thread as looking at where he might have worked. If areas of employment interest could thereby be identified in San Francisco based on the mail drops, and given that the directories for the areas covered by Rossmo’s profile for the likely places of residence list (broadly) place (or area) of work, then this would (in regard to future use of your work) permit vastly limiting the subset of persons living in the GeoProfile areas remaining ‘of interest’.

But that’s a lot of assumptions. And maybe I’ve got some, or all, of them wrong.

Sorry, I’m loosely following it — is the purpose to establish which businesses were located close to the various mailboxes?

If so, that seems like a long shot, unless multiple letters were mailed from the same box. In reality, weren’t the letters mailed from various mailboxes all over the city?

And to connect two guys who lived in Vallejo and worked for Greyhound, because a letter was mailed near a Greyhound travel office in San Francisco?

Hmm . . .

(Also back then, the Greyhound depot — which would be the SF headquarters — was located at 6th and Market streets. That’s where drivers and most employees would go to work, if they were based out of San Francisco.)

Sure, Xcaliber, your ‘Hmm…’ is justified in the sense of doubting that any specific importance should be given to such a loose connection in regard to my random example of the ‘Greyhound’ guys. But, I suppose what I was focussing on is the idea of (at some future time) using information about likely places of work in San Francisco to support an ‘exclusion’ process of individuals resident in the GeoProfile areas.

If your study of the mailboxes leads to the conclusion that the letter writer worked either in San Francisco, or travelled through San Francisco to get to work daily, then for starters you could exclude immediately the significant number of people listed in the Vallejo areas as working at, say, the MINS, or perhaps USN, local grocers, people listed as retired. I suppose all I was suggesting in regard to the Greyhound worker example is that these two guys initially wouldn’t be open to being excluded as easily and (only) as such would be of more interest.

But I need to let you all get back to what you were doing. I’ve been an unhelpful distraction, I am sure.