Also, the Zodiac uses the phrase “the girl who’s never kissed”. This phrase is only used in the Marx version, no?

No. Green says this in some versions as well, including the one I’ve referenced.

I believe he either wrote it from memory and had misheard some lyrics, or that he tried to write it as the record was playing. The penmanship doesn’t indicate that he was writing particularly fast, which makes the "from memory" idea more appealing. But if he was listening to the record, maybe he went through a few drafts until he thought "good enough!", or maybe he was sitting there moving the needle on the record player in order to re-listen to the tricky bits (like I have been over the past few days!), which could account for some of the weird multi-word omissions if he didn’t put the needle back in quite the right place.

We’ll never know, I guess. For me, the most enticing possibility, however remote, is that we could connect him to a particular physical object.

I believe he either wrote it from memory and had misheard some lyrics, or that he tried to write it as the record was playing. The penmanship doesn’t indicate that he was writing particularly fast, which makes the "from memory" idea more appealing. But if he was listening to the record, maybe he went through a few drafts until he thought "good enough!", or maybe he was sitting there moving the needle on the record player in order to re-listen to the tricky bits (like I have been over the past few days!), which could account for some of the weird multi-word omissions if he didn’t put the needle back in quite the right place.

We’ll never know, I guess. For me, the most enticing possibility, however remote, is that we could connect him to a particular physical object.

It’s definitely compelling evidence. Bravo.

One would have to think that he listened to this record constantly. Perhaps obsessively. I have listened to albums again and again, and I am unsure I’d be able to transcribe lyrics that I heard from memory.

I’d love for Tahoe to give her two cents here.

It seems that some would have it that he was a great idiot, incapable of correctly spelling the lyrics to a simple song. And yet they would also have it, that memorizing the lyrics is some great feat of intellect. Which is it? Was he a moron, or a genius? Perhaps he was some kind of idiot savant. Perhaps he was raised in a swamp and learnt to speak only by listening to voices of passing motorists. OR you know, maybe he was being sarcastic, which is not at all a trait he displayed in great abundance.

Gilbert and Sullivan lyrics are very memorable, they have a way of getting stuck in your head like lines from Pride and Prejudice, or a Monty Python routine. People have no trouble quoting the Simpsons, or Batman, so why should it be so difficult to remember Gilbert and Sullivan? Certainly I would say it indicates strongly that he was quite a fan, perhaps even obsessively so, but it doesn’t require any greater fandom than is common for musical theatre.

I think it’s far more likely that he quoted them phonetically simply because it amused him. It amuses me.

I’ve found him! https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/p__/i … rotagonist

I think this forum has really contributed something. Since it has become the popular belief that Zodiac was a drooling idiot, we now have a great many new leads. We can now search in earnest for the person who drove his car for him, the person who bought his guns, the person who changed his diaper. Indeed, if we can just track down his occupational therapist the case will be entirely solved.

I shouldn’t heap it on so much. Truly I have no idea how this has taken hold of people the way it has. The spelling mistakes in the Little List are preposterous, they are not even consistent with his previous spelling mistakes. By the time of the Little List letter, the idea that he was doing anything other than misspelling on purpose, is completely indefensible. It’s been pointed out ad nauseam that many of the mistakes are not phonetic, as one would expect from genuine misspellings; although I think this point is rather moot, again given that by the time of this letter, his misspellings had become so outrageous and ridiculous, so as to dispel any lingering doubt.

Now that I’ve gone back over the original ZKS thread for probably the first time in 7 years: Mike R. pointed out that the "kissed" line is in the Martyn Green version. Back in 2013.

This 2009 Zkdotcom thread is essentially the prequel to the ZKS thread:
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/zodiack … 3-s10.html

Tahoe brought up the Groucho version, saying: ""Not that the lyrics were exclusive to Groucho." Then, people went bonkers for the Groucho angle. 2 years later, she announced there was no doubt in her mind it’s the Groucho version, for reasons unclear to me.

Someone ELSE, toward the end of the thread, drew the same conclusion, while (allegedly) being unaware of Tahoe’s posts.

Seems like only Rodelli was aware of the Green version. Also, this Groucho theory would have probably happened w/o Tahoe, just later.

Most people can’t even be bothered to do simple Google searches for "Richard Gaikowski" or "Arthur Leigh Allen" — or spell their names properly…is anyone really shocked that some inadequate research from 10 years ago slipped past the radar? I was, for a day or two. And I’ve had theories that were torn apart on the spot. Oh well, I’m going to read the YB again.

Replaceablehead,

I’m not following you. Are you saying that Zodiac was a genius and the misspelling was intentional?

There is a suspect with an MGM connection. I’ll let that go for now…

Again, the Xmas/Eureka card undoubtedly played a huge role in the Groucho theory taking off like it did…someone got DNA-checked because of those P.O. box keys.

The Mikado was a pillar of mainstream pop culture and older guys from that era were watching Lawrence Welk, not The Midnight Special. My only standing theory about The Mikado is that Z might have referenced it due to Belli’s Japan fixation.

Replaceablehead,

I’m not following you. Are you saying that Zodiac was a genius and the misspelling was intentional?

Sorry, I should have been more polite. I am saying that he would have to be a profound idiot if the misspellings are genuine. As to how intelligent he was, I can hardly begin to speculate, but I would say in the balance average intellegence, maybe above, maybe a smidge bellow, it’s complicated topic, but the misspellings are really not plausible. I mean the first letter, sure, maybe, but as they continue it just goes off the deep end into the realms of outright ridiculous. If your spelling is that bad, how can you write at all? When I get home I’ll find some examples of implausible misspellings.

Here are a few of what I consider the most egregious examples. Only "silowets" can be sounded out phonetically and I suppose "doo", but come on, a two letter word? Some even contain superfluous letters.

drownding
silowets
cerous
controol
doo
howers
evere
sucides

Consider the follow in terms of grammar:

"If not, tell them to cheer up; when they do crack it, they will have me."

"When I fired the first shot at his head, he leaped backwards at the same time, thus spoiling my aim. He ended up on the back seat then the floor in back thashing out very violently with his legs; that’s how I shot him in the knee."

"All I had to do was spray them as if it was a water hose; there was no need to use the gun sights"

The Zodiac is quite adept at using semi colons.

"They did not openly state this, but implied this by saying it was a well lit night + I could see silowets on the horizon."

The Zodiac is able to concisely articulate his perception. Also the word silhouette is surely a little advanced for someone who can’t spell it.

"So I shall change the way the collecting of slaves."

The Zodiac does not display any great vocabulary. However, here are a few words that do not jibe with his spelling abilities:

routine
silowets
transparent
suspicious
disappeared
photoelectric switch
ammonium nitrate fertilizer
gorged
radians

This is quite a short list of examples, others have made far more in-depth examinations. Perhaps the most important thing to notice is the inconsistency, one moment being able to construct good sentences and the next barely coherent.
Certainly his writing style is strange. I think though as you read through the letters the taunting tone, the cheekiness, the tone fits the misspellings, they make sense, giving the writing an irreverent and insolent tone, and also serving to mask his true self. He sounds like a troll. I mean maybe he was drunk, or high, but I really think he was just being a troll.

I think he was a bad speller. I don’t think that means he was an idiot. I also don’t think it precludes the possibility that played up the misspellings to toy with people.

I don’t agree that "As Someday it May Happen" is a simple song. The syntax is weird. The pacing is fast. There’s a lot of cultural knowledge required to interpret it. There are French and Latin phrases. I think it’s simpler to suppose that Zodiac wasn’t familiar, for instance, with the term "nisi prius" (I’ll admit that I wasn’t) than that he *was* but that for some reason didn’t want people to think he was.

Anyway, I really do think it’s worthwhile to do some forensic linguistics on the Little List letter, and I’m a linguist, so I’ll keep at it. Maybe it’s a fool’s errand, but I’m a bit of a fool .

I definitely agree that he was a proto-troll, and that he might’ve started deliberately misspelling things once the newspapers started talking about his mistakes.

Here are a few of what I consider the most egregious examples. Only "silowets" can be sounded out phonetically and I suppose "doo", but come on, a two letter word? Some even contain superfluous letters.

drownding
silowets
cerous
controol
doo
howers
evere
sucides

Consider the follow in terms of grammar:

"If not, tell them to cheer up; when they do crack it, they will have me."

"When I fired the first shot at his head, he leaped backwards at the same time, thus spoiling my aim. He ended up on the back seat then the floor in back thashing out very violently with his legs; that’s how I shot him in the knee."

"All I had to do was spray them as if it was a water hose; there was no need to use the gun sights"

The Zodiac is quite adept at using semi colons.

"They did not openly state this, but implied this by saying it was a well lit night + I could see silowets on the horizon."

The Zodiac is able to concisely articulate his perception. Also the word silhouette is surely a little advanced for someone who can’t spell it.

"So I shall change the way the collecting of slaves."

The Zodiac does not display any great vocabulary. However, here are a few words that do not jibe with his spelling abilities:

routine
silowets
transparent
suspicious
disappeared
photoelectric switch
ammonium nitrate fertilizer
gorged
radians

This is quite a short list of examples, others have made far more in-depth examinations. Perhaps the most important thing to notice is the inconsistency, one moment being able to construct good sentences and the next barely coherent.
Certainly his writing style is strange. I think though as you read through the letters the taunting tone, the cheekiness, the tone fits the misspellings, they make sense, giving the writing an irreverent and insolent tone, and also serving to mask his true self. He sounds like a troll. I mean maybe he was drunk, or high, but I really think he was just being a troll.

This is only anecdotal evidence, so I’m not suggesting it’s proof. But I am a college English professor, and I taught high school English for several years as well. I can tell you that I have seen many examples of people who spell this poorly. Even misspelling the same word two different ways in the same paper. Sometimes even highly respected people.

What is of note is that many of these people do not speak English as their first language. Others are simply under-educated. Perhaps English was a new language for Zodiac, but more likely, he was a poor student and barely passed or dropped out of high school early.

Just my two cents.

As far as anecdotes go, I suppose yours must carry some weight. I admit, in the age of electronic communication I don’t encounter many hand written missives. But having said that, in my lifetime I have encountered my fair share of poor spellers and it’s been my observation at least that people make the same common mistakes and if uncertain resort to at least logical phonetic misspellings. So I suppose it just doesn’t jibe with my own experience.

I’ve been trying to think how someone could come to the conclusion that they are unintentional misspellings. I feel in part that it’s because there seems no good reason for intentional misspellings. The idea that he did it to disguise his intelligence doesn’t seem like a terribly strong argument, because it would seem he could have more effectively dumbed himself down if that was his intent. So a good reason for the misspellings not being found, it seems much more reasonable to conclude they are accidental. I don’t like this reasoning though, it makes it too easy to dismiss the outrageousness of the misspellings. You start to reason "well he must have been that bad a speller, or why else would he have done it?". I think that reasoning is too insular. It’s kind of like "he did it, because he could", which might be valid if someone is examining minute details for hidden meaning, but using it to dismiss truly outlandish behaviour is problematic.

Reasonable minds differ. Still, drownding vs. ammonium nitrate fertilizer? I mean, just sound it out, the extra "d" is totally superfluous. Why would anyone struggling to spell drowning arrive at adding a "d" sound to the end? It doesn’t seem very likely to me, unless you were drunk, or in a mad hurry to finish.

I think the best evidence that the misspelling is intentional is the Little List. Misheard lyrics are common enough, but I’ve never seen anyone try to replace lyrics with phonetic gibberish. "phomphit", "singurly", I mean you can hear as plain as day that he says "puff it", Henry Higgins himself couldn’t enunciate it with greater precision. Martyn Greens enunciation is peerless. The songs tempo is listed in most scores as a very pedestrian 80 bpm, although my tempo app had it as high as 110 during the faster passages, that ain’t fast though. Short of having Patrick Stewart shout every syllable into your earhole, I’m hard pressed to image how the lyrics could be made any more distinct. I cannot agree that the lyrics are difficult to understand, at least audibly; vocabulary is another matter, but not one that I think is relevant to spelling "puff".

Has anyone looked into the idea that english was not Z’s first language?

I have often felt like the mixed bag of cultural associations, the spelling mistakes and the odd turns of phrase that sometimes feel strained or awkward, could point to someone who may have had a different language as their primary tongue.