Zodiac Discussion Forum

Symbols and letters…
 
Notifications
Clear all

Symbols and letters 340 Key

86 Posts
7 Users
27 Likes
11 K Views
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

Hello, :)
I noticed (sometime ago) that the sequence EBEORIETEMETEHHPITI, is formed by 9 vowels and 9 consonants, and also by 9 letters when taken one by one, I mean
EBORITMHP.

9-9-9 (666)
Or white Beatles album, number 9 number 9 number 9

sorry for the tour.

Now, observing the "theory of typewriter keyboards" I noticed that, the letters that make up the sequence ( except M)are symmetrically adjacent, I say 3-3-2.


sharing only.

Marcelo

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 5, 2021 11:11 pm
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

I am reposting here to maintain the line of analysis that I have been doing, and to keep this in a timeline, that facilitates my research and also localization by third parties.

Some time ago I noticed in this topic http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtopic.php?f=81&t=3808 that the months written in the letter that came together with the cipher 340, abbreviated, with the exception of July, when arranged without space are 17 letters long, also in the same post, I noticed that the months when written in full mode, without spaces, it is 34 letters long (17 x 2).
I found it curious at the time.

DESJULYAUGSEPTOCT

DECEMBERJULYAUGUSTSEPTEMBEROCTOBER

Well, I thought these days and remembered that the last two lines when deciphered are distinct from the reading for breaking the cipher (period 19), and that it is 34 in length.

Well, I went to Dave’s website and did these art

"THE END" appears symmetrically in the vertical corners, exactly where the end is (metalanguage maybe)

THE END

Marcelo

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 24, 2021 1:01 am
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

Nothing very important, but, as I noted in another topic, the distance between the symbols / letters, is equal to 18, the same size as the sequence of 18 letters at the end of the Z408, I say EBEORIETEMETEHHPITI, which results in period 19 that the team used to decode. It may be a coincidence, it is very likely that it is, but, as always, sharing

Marcelo

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 24, 2021 2:30 am
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

Interestingly, the letters I and H, of the sequence, which form I H ope, are right at the end of each line, also IRO in a mirror appears in a certain way.
weird
Shared

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 24, 2021 3:18 am
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

I set up this image to make my thoughts clear. I mean, check, the cipher, in its first 18 lines, was divided into two parts, which reading in period 19, in two parts gave the result, more or less that.
It illustrates my thoughts I think

Part 1 EBEORIETE , PART 2 METHHPITI

Marcelo ;)

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 24, 2021 5:21 am
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

Well, I know that the message decoded by the team at z 340, at least partially, speaks of the TV show, and not being afraid of Gas’s camera, which is something that goes on in the future the publication of the z408 obviously.

In the meantime looking at old antique articles from http://zodiackillerciphers.com/wiki/index.php?title=Encyclopedia_of_observations, I found the constant observations curious

" The 408 and 340 ciphers fit exactly into two standard-size pages ruled into half-inch squares. The 408 will use one page plus one inch from another page. The second page will then fit the 340 exactly." (from Jem) (Open question: Is the 340 a continuation of the 408?)".

By Jem : http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtopic.php?f=81&t=296
By Entropy http://zodiackillerciphers.com/images/z340-and-z408-on-grids.jpg

The middle of the 408 (line 12) coincides with the beginning of the second part of 9 lines of the 340 ( line 10)which in turn is half of the cipher 340 as a whole (17×20) , que (in a theoretical continuation, I mean, 408/340), which were deciphered in reading in period 19.
That is (in this projection):

Line 12 of 408, coincides:
1-with half of CIPHER 340 (line 10)
2-with the line that starts the "second part" of what we observed in the decoding of 340. (Which was divided into 9/9/2)

I keep wondering, if there was already a cipher project (by the zodiac) as it is.
Transposition in period 19 in two parts of 9 lines, and transposition in mirror in the last two lines.
I mean, the message, whatever it was, was supposed to be encrypted this way regardless of its content.
I imagine that the beginning "I HOPE YOU ARE HAVING A LOTS OF FUN IN TRYNG …" would fit any message, whatever it was.
Some time ago I noticed that the symbols "Alphabetical and non-Alphabetical, when divided, of both ciphers, has almost the size of the cipher,
there are 403 alphabetical symbols
there are 345 not alphabetical symbols.
http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtopic.php?p=43108#p43108

I say this because, I imagine, that the values ​​given the keys of both ciphers, I imagine, must have been conceived before everything.
Speculum

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 29, 2021 1:16 am
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

I made these two arts, the first with the cipher 340 in its plaintext not transposed and the second transposed, for better visualization

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 29, 2021 2:38 am
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

probably coincidence, but, as always, I share.

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 29, 2021 4:09 am
(@upsampled)
Posts: 2
New Member
 

I say this because, I imagine, that the values ​​given the keys of both ciphers, I imagine, must have been conceived before everything.
Speculum

As stated in the my other thread, I think looking to see if the keys are non-random (at least seeing if Z340’s key is based on Z408’s key) is worth a look. Random key generation is still a big part of security (see password cracking and RNG Seeding/entropy). That Army Manual shared before says that you should pick keys as if picking letters out of a bag. If this was done for the Z340 and Z408 then if you count the letters a symbol was shifted (Symbols ‘E’ was shifted 13 letters from z408 Letter ‘E’ to z340 Letter ‘R’) and compared them they should be uniformly random. This at least initially does not look like the case. There are A LOT of 13 letter shifts which is a very human thing to do ( look at the joke cipher ROT13).

I still need to look at this more. I know the change in the symbol slots per letter, addition/removal of symbols, etc complicate the analysis so I need to account for this when I have time.

but would love some feedback, do you think they keys are randomly generate?

 
Posted : January 29, 2021 6:33 am
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

Hello

Well, I don’t know if you read this topic: http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtopic.php?f=81&t=2419&hilit=qwerty
It was observed that, in part, the values (keys) of the symbols had their value assigned by adjacent keys in a standard QWERT typewriter.

After Sam, Dave and Jarvle broke the cipher 340 I observed the same phenomenon (I posted something on this same topic).

I would very much like to know if , this phenomenon , can be random , I mean , using the letter tracks on a keyboard generating symbols and/or letters would be the same as using random values. A mathematical study, made by someone more capable that I should be made

I have observed your graph containing the preanalysis of the rot13 phenomenon, I confess that I have not looked nor compiled yet all the keys (340/408) for visual verification.

I’m going to assemble something around it and post it here.

Note that , English is not my natural language, so if something is not understood by you , you can inform me.

In short, I don’t think the keys are random.

See this image about symbols and neighboring letters on typewriter keyboards, and read, when you have a time, the topic about the "standard typewriter in 408." -That is not official and homologated at all.
z13 exemple:

340 key:

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 29, 2021 7:08 am
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

For example, when side by side, in two pages, placed both ciphers, there are some mirrored symbols or Y, or the same, like knowing, first, if this is random, second, if not, the author of the cipher simply, the measure that mounted the 340 looked at the symbol beside and assigned another value.
Therefore, if this has any meaning, it may have been keys with random touches and based on keyboards.
I can’t say. I just speculate.

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 29, 2021 7:18 am
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

Hello.
Yesterday looking at Dave’s recent video, I thought about the words in mirror (two last lines of the decoded cipher 340)
As I have already shared in this topic, the final sequence of cipher 408, EBEORIETEMETEHHPITI, when arranged, the same shape as the cipher, in 17 columns of length 18 rows, we have, something, visually, similar to the decoding reading.
I made in mirror the sequence
Some curiosities appear
1-The IRO sequence (beginning of the planintext)
2-EIT
3- the "triangle of letters H
4- Placed side by side, the inverse triangle
5-A Sequence ( EBEORITEMETHHPITI, by logic , written vertically ( more or less close to the method suggested in the one of encoding )
6- The letter H that forms the tringle on line 15, is exactly the one that was moved and moved 13 symbols to the lefth.

Actually, now I can’t tell if this is a coincidence or not, which added to other observations I posted right here, (the two ciphers together)
show something that aroused my tremendous curiosity

Would this sequence be a kind of "key hint"?

EBEORIETEMETHHPITI

ITIPHHTEMETEIROEBE

Marcelo :)

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 31, 2021 10:09 pm
(@druzer)
Posts: 229
Estimable Member
 

Fascinating as always Marcelo! Thanks for sharing

 
Posted : January 31, 2021 10:19 pm
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

Thanks Druzer
:D

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 31, 2021 11:05 pm
Marclean
(@marcelo-leandro)
Posts: 764
Prominent Member
Topic starter
 

How curious , the three letters H (lines 14 and 15) are in the same position , I mean, line 14 , that appears "THING"( that appears in "bold" in the letter of Z) , that I had already observed before , when both broken ciphers are put in two pages and in sequence

THING


:)

https://zodiacode1933.blogspot.com/

 
Posted : January 31, 2021 11:49 pm
Page 2 / 6
Share: