Why were the windows down? You assume that it was cold.

It was described as being unseasonably warm that night. In fact one of my contacts was a little kid named Dana at the time who heard a scream that night because his bedroom window was open from the uncomfortable weather.

Very interesting ! Can you tell us anything more about Dana and where he lived in relation to the crime scene ?

He lived on Ramona quite close to the alley. It’s since been torn down and the area has been rebuilt.

Here’s the Dana segment of my "The Curse of the Confession" podcast I edited out because the podcast was getting too long:

"On the night before Halloween, a little boy named Dana was having trouble falling asleep. For reasons he didn’t quite understand, his parents had turned their clock backwards an hour, and by his usual bedtime, Dana just wasn’t tired. It was also very hot that night. Dana had his bedroom window open, and at some point during the night, he heard a woman scream. And the next day, Dana learned about a dead girl, who was found in an alley that wasn’t very far from his open bedroom window. At that point, Dana’s parents told him that he was no longer to go anywhere near that alley. Which was fine with Dana, because in the little boy’s imagination, the dead girl’s body might still be there. But soon, his natural curiosity got the best of him, and Dana mustered the courage to explore the area where the girl had been killed. Eventually, while exploring, Dana found a knife. He already knew the dead girl had been killed with a knife, and he also knew he should give that knife he found to his mom and dad. But at Dana’s age, getting caught disobeying his parents wasn’t an option. And they had told him, in no uncertain terms, to stay away from that alley. So Dana put the knife back where he found it. And from that moment on, he’s lived with a huge weight on his shoulders: The guilt of living his life knowing that if he had given that knife to his parents, they would have turned it over to the police. And the police just might have found a clue on that knife, a clue that could have lead to justice for that dead girl in the alley. When I spoke to Dana, I told him "look, that knife you found probably wasn’t the murder weapon." But that was all the time and effort I spent trying to ease his burdon. Because I already knew that Dana was going to feel guilty for the rest of his life."

Why were the windows down? You assume that it was cold.

It was described as being unseasonably warm that night. In fact one of my contacts was a little kid named Dana at the time who heard a scream that night because his bedroom window was open from the uncomfortable weather.

I can completely see this. CA has very strange weather in Spring and Fall.

Weather report for Riverside CA. Oct. 30th 1966: high 97 F. low 48 F.

Quite a temp. swing huh ? And a full moon too !

It was described as being unseasonably warm that night. In fact one of my contacts was a little kid named Dana at the time who heard a scream that night because his bedroom window was open from the uncomfortable weather.

Very interesting ! Can you tell us anything more about Dana and where he lived in relation to the crime scene ?

He lived on Ramona quite close to the alley. It’s since been torn down and the area has been rebuilt.

Here’s the Dana segment of my "The Curse of the Confession" podcast I edited out because the podcast was getting too long:

"On the night before Halloween, a little boy named Dana was having trouble falling asleep. For reasons he didn’t quite understand, his parents had turned their clock backwards an hour, and by his usual bedtime, Dana just wasn’t tired. It was also very hot that night. Dana had his bedroom window open, and at some point during the night, he heard a woman scream. And the next day, Dana learned about a dead girl, who was found in an alley that wasn’t very far from his open bedroom window. At that point, Dana’s parents told him that he was no longer to go anywhere near that alley. Which was fine with Dana, because in the little boy’s imagination, the dead girl’s body might still be there. But soon, his natural curiosity got the best of him, and Dana mustered the courage to explore the area where the girl had been killed. Eventually, while exploring, Dana found a knife. He already knew the dead girl had been killed with a knife, and he also knew he should give that knife he found to his mom and dad. But at Dana’s age, getting caught disobeying his parents wasn’t an option. And they had told him, in no uncertain terms, to stay away from that alley. So Dana put the knife back where he found it. And from that moment on, he’s lived with a huge weight on his shoulders: The guilt of living his life knowing that if he had given that knife to his parents, they would have turned it over to the police. And the police just might have found a clue on that knife, a clue that could have lead to justice for that dead girl in the alley. When I spoke to Dana, I told him "look, that knife you found probably wasn’t the murder weapon." But that was all the time and effort I spent trying to ease his burdon. Because I already knew that Dana was going to feel guilty for the rest of his life."

Very interesting Tom, thanks for posting this !

Even though people who knew her visited the library later in the evening, Cheri was last seen at 6:15 in that small library. She had arrived 10 to 15 minutes prior to the library opening, indicating she wanted to get her library business over with and get on with her night. All she was there to do was check out a couple of books, which would not have taken long. My theory is she made it back to her car by 6:15 and that was when her ordeal began. I believe her killer quickly approached her car after she tried starting it, he had a gun and demanded she get into his nearby car. If that scenario is accurate, she wasn’t killed until a minimum of three hours later, and as many as six. She certainly was not taken directly to the alley and attacked.

Ok, that explains why no one saw her in the library. But, if she is abducted at gun point at or around 6:15 p.m., and there were no indications of torture, ligature marks, or sexual assault of any kind, what happened in the intervening 3 hours? I’m not saying I disagree, but generally one does not abduct someone to play chess or talk for hours. And if he put her in a car, why bring her back? Why not just kill her and dispose of the body elsewhere?

According to Det. Steve Shumway Cheri was in the library until a little AFTER 9 P.M.

I know some of Shumway’s statements are inconsistent with the facts in the autopsy so take what he
says with a grain of salt.

You can see his statement on Youtube.

Go to Youtube and search "the hunt for the zodiac killer" and click on Season 1 Episode 1 and skip to
the 7 minute mark.

(I can’t create a link for this so if a MOD can make a link to this excerpt please do.)

Shumway. Ugh. He’s repeating BS fed to him by his mentor, Bud Kelly. Shumway also told me Cheri was stabbed 42 times. He clearly is as unfamiliar with Cheri’s case as can be. If Shumway says 9 PM, it’s a lock to be 6:15 PM.

Shumway. Ugh. He’s repeating BS fed to him by his mentor, Bud Kelly. Shumway also told me Cheri was stabbed 42 times. He clearly is as unfamiliar with Cheri’s case as can be. If Shumway says 9 PM, it’s a lock to be 6:15 PM.

The guy brought the crew to the wrong spot at RCC on Hunting the Zodiac, his knowledge is definitely shaky

The one thing we do know, is the 4 workmen reported nobody else floating around her vehicle during the critical period, other than Cheri Jo Bates.

Which is worthless because for all we know, they were mostly preoccupied doing their work.

We all know that an attractive young woman like Cheri would likely be noticed and mentioned by some male construction workers. She would get their attention. Would a man or an old lady get and keep their attention? Doubtful.

As far as the multi hour time period being discussed, if Cheri left with some killer predator, would she have safely come back hours later? I doubt it. If she left with anyone for hours and then came back safely, she likely left with someone she knew, and something went wrong when she got back

If we can, let’s get back on track and keep this thread for specific discussion of Ross.
Feel free to discuss Cheri and her murder specifically in the Cheri section, thanks
viewtopic.php?f=33&t=5423

Nevermind

Coffee Time is probably referencing from this;
http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtop … =10#p74316
http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtop … =20#p74345

Yes, "Bud Kelly propaganda," though I wasn’t specifically referring to those posts. But when I was last here, we were debating the accomplice theory, not when she left the library…seems like a distant memory now…

Anyway, the 2 men/flashlight story came from the same source as Bob Barnett’s supposed confession (and other incriminating BB info). Well, if Barnett actually confessed, he’d be my #1 suspect and I would be done with these threads. So I assume that is Bud Kelly Story Time. Is the flashlight anecdote exempt from this?

(Note: this was originally was about Ross having an accomplice)

Again, please move all Cheri Bates specific talk over to here section or here- viewtopic.php?f=33&t=5423
Keep this section for Ross

Cheri was just at the library to do her bibliography, right?

This leaves a very short time frame for anyone to meddle with her car in broad day light. (takes only minutes to retrieve such info) .

Bibliography needed to be typed, could she have left the library and walked somewhere nearby to use a typewriter?

She was there to check out a couple of books.

Wow, lots of Ross talk of late. The issue for me has always been the lack of a verifiable link to Vallejo, etc.
He’s still on my suspect list, but he is now #2. I feel pretty confident in saying, I think I know who Zodiac was!

Who?

Someone who is currently being evaluated as a suspect by the powers that be. A lot of stuff uncovered so far by a small team of people working together. I promise that if/when it’s revealed that I am right, a slew of information will be in place ready to release. I am not sure that the people working with me are ready to declare this guy Z, but I am going on record, I think this is the guy

Yes, That’s why I’m back lurking in the corridors watching what people are discussing.