Hi Calman…

I like the idea of Joe Stine as being the Zodiac. Reddish-brown, clean-cut hair, scratches in his face after the Stine murder, knew Darlene Ferrin, gas station in Modesto, bragging around etc…not saying it’s like that, but definitely at least an approach. Does anybody know if Joe Stine was suffering from dyslexia? Or do we have some handwriting samples?

On the other hand he sort of is ruled out if you believe in the authenticity of the last two presumed-to-be Z letters (killed by a freeway / 2nd Herb Caen), as he had died earlier.

QT

Hi Calman…

I like the idea of Joe Stine as being the Zodiac. Reddish-brown, clean-cut hair, scratches in his face after the Stine murder, knew Darlene Ferrin, gas station in Modesto, bragging around etc…not saying it’s like that, but definitely at least an approach. Does anybody know if Joe Stine was suffering from dyslexia? Or do we have some handwriting samples?

On the other hand he sort of is ruled out if you believe in the authenticity of the last two presumed-to-be Z letters (killed by a freeway / 2nd Herb Caen), as he had died earlier.

QT

Distasteful accusation aside, there’s no evidence Joe knew any of the other Zodiac victims.

Hi Calman…

I like the idea of Joe Stine as being the Zodiac. Reddish-brown, clean-cut hair, scratches in his face after the Stine murder, knew Darlene Ferrin, gas station in Modesto, bragging around etc…not saying it’s like that, but definitely at least an approach. Does anybody know if Joe Stine was suffering from dyslexia? Or do we have some handwriting samples?

On the other hand he sort of is ruled out if you believe in the authenticity of the last two presumed-to-be Z letters (killed by a freeway / 2nd Herb Caen), as he had died earlier.

QT

Distasteful accusation aside, there’s no evidence Joe knew any of the other Zodiac victims.

I agree, that’s something that’s been thrown out there before, and is indeed Distasteful.

Excusée moi..

..of course I don’t want anybody to believe me having a lack of taste but:

Is the information wrong that Joe Stine had been living in Vallejo? And that Joe Stine, only few days after the murder, had some solid scratches in his face? And that he bragged around that he wouldn’t need any weapons to confront Z?

Furthermore that Paul Stine had lived in a residence near/on Eddy Street? (‘Also living there Darlene Ferrin and Mike Mageau. Darlene’s future husband lived in a residence building two doors down. Paul Lee Stine used to drive Darlene Ferrin around in his cab.’

Well if Darlene had known Paul Stine it is not that unrealistic that she might have known his brother as well, is it? New to me was the info that Darlene’s first husband had been working in Albany..

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archiv … 80617.html
http://zodiackiller.fr.yuku.com/topic/6 … 969?page=4
http://darcsfalcon.wordpress.com/zodiac/
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. … 264&page=3

In fact I don’t know. Somewhere I had read that Paul and Joe had an argument days before? And that their mother stopped talking, later went on medicamentation after the death of Paul?
http://www.officialcoldcaseinvestigatio … php?t=3289

IMO just the fact that Joe was his brother makes him being a POTENTIAL suspect (one of 2,500), but there for sure might be better ones. Anybody some handwriting of Joe?

QT

Excusée moi..

..of course I don’t want anybody to believe me having a lack of taste but:

Is the information wrong that Joe Stine had been living in Vallejo? And that Joe Stine, only few days after the murder, had some solid scratches in his face? And that he bragged around that he wouldn’t need any weapons to confront Z?

Furthermore that Paul Stine had lived in a residence near/on Eddy Street? (‘Also living there Darlene Ferrin and Mike Mageau. Darlene’s future husband lived in a residence building two doors down. Paul Lee Stine used to drive Darlene Ferrin around in his cab.’

Well if Darlene had known Paul Stine it is not that unrealistic that she might have known his brother as well, is it? New to me was the info that Darlene’s first husband had been working in Albany..

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archiv … 80617.html
http://zodiackiller.fr.yuku.com/topic/6 … 969?page=4
http://darcsfalcon.wordpress.com/zodiac/
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. … 264&page=3

In fact I don’t know. Somewhere I had read that Paul and Joe had an argument days before? And that their mother stopped talking, later went on medicamentation after the death of Paul?
http://www.officialcoldcaseinvestigatio … php?t=3289

IMO just the fact that Joe was his brother makes him being a POTENTIAL suspect (one of 2,500), but there for sure might be better ones. Anybody some handwriting of Joe?
rambling
QT

The issue QT, is that just about everything you posted or referenced in your post is all unconfirmed heresay and internet BS.

It was never proven that Paul Stine knew Darlene. If he did, that would be amazing I think,but there’s no proof of it. Joe STine had lived in Vallejo,but so did alot of people. As far as the ‘scratches’, wasnt it decided he had acne scars? As far as Joe’s challenge to Zodiac, he was mad and probably let his emotions get the better of him when he publicly challenged Zodiac. As far as the fight between Joe & Paul, last I checked,Brothers get in fights,usually over something dumb,and then they make up. Most don’t shoot the other one in the back of the head.

You are entitled to your own opinion, but this is sort of like the accusation made by somebody that Bryan Hartnell was part of the Zodiac team,and allowed himself to be stabbed, it just doesn’t make sense.

True, most don’t. If I remember the www bs right, the quarrel was about an insurance sum..

Nevertheless (nice to use eee’s again) I’d feel better if we could rule him completely out, e.g. by his height or handwriting. So this would come to an end..same with his bike and the ONS/EAR who once fled with a bike, too. And yes, I also do have one.

QT

True, most don’t. If I remember the www bs right, the quarrel was about an insurance sum..

Nevertheless (nice to use eee’s again) I’d feel better if we could rule him completely out, e.g. by his height or handwriting. So this would come to an end..same with his bike and the ONS/EAR who once fled with a bike, too. And yes, I also do have one.

QT

Family is the first to be looked at! Family murder is more common than that of strangers.

While Joe may very well not have been Paul’s killer or Zodiac, I don’t think there is anything wrong with discussing the possibility….OR even more-so, Joe could have known Zodiac (and not been directly involved).

Joe was listed in Vallejo as of late ’68. The scratches are up for debate. Joe did have (with the help of his sister) Paul put into a mental institution…I’d say that is a bit more unusual than most siblings would do. I’m guessing they weren’t too close after that, but again, that doesn’t make Joe Paul’s killer. What Joe did does seem a bit bold, but like Morf said…he could have just been angry. But he did put his family in further jeopardy, imo.

As with Cheri Jo, it was written in an article that her own father and brother were taken into consideration and ruled out. I have to wonder if the same thing was done in Paul’s case…and others as well

Kind of curious ,what ever happened to cab 912 ?

Kind of curious ,what ever happened to cab 912 ?

Think I’ve read that it went into a police storage for further investigation (prints), guess it might still be there..or the cab company asked for it to get it back..

‘Ok..now that you have passed your cab driver license test, we’ll give you a brand new cab for your daily work. Good luck.’

QT

For those of you looking into Stine’s murder, consider this following fact. Remember the housekeeper at MB’s house receiving the ”Christmas” call? It purportedly had Z saying it was his birthday, December 18th, and he would kill again. Who else was born on December18th? Yes, that’s right, Paul Lee Stine.

1 14 70 RE: SAN FRANCISCO AIRTEL DECEMBER TWENTY NINE LAST. On instant date Insp. (name redacted), Homicide Detail, San Francisco Police Department, confidentially advised that UNSUB, who identified himself as ‘Zodiac,’ telephonically contacted attorney Melvin Belli’s residence in effort to contact Belli. UNSUB was advised Belli was in Europe and stated, "I can’t wait. Today’s my birthday."
The call likely happened on or close to January 14th, not December 18th (which was also Allen’s birthday). The December 18th call is just a product of Graysmith and the film. The call didn’t happen on December 18th. Belli left for Europe on the 20th December.

He could have been telling the truth or he could have been lying about it being his birthday thinking he would get his wish to speak with Belli then!

1 14 70 RE: SAN FRANCISCO AIRTEL DECEMBER TWENTY NINE LAST. On instant date Insp. (name redacted), Homicide Detail, San Francisco Police Department, confidentially advised that UNSUB, who identified himself as ‘Zodiac,’ telephonically contacted attorney Melvin Belli’s residence in effort to contact Belli. UNSUB was advised Belli was in Europe and stated, "I can’t wait. Today’s my birthday."
The call likely happened on or close to January 14th, not December 18th (which was also Allen’s birthday). The December 18th call is just a product of Graysmith and the film. The call didn’t happen on December 18th. Belli left for Europe on the 20th December.

Thanks, Richard, for this clarification. It’s frustrating how (so often with Zodiac) rumor and innuendo can evolve into so-called facts.

As I understand it:
1. Stine’s cab had a noticeable dent in its side;
2. Z is believed to have shared the front seat with Stine.
A cabbie wouldn’t share his seat with a ride unless he knew him/her. And, since Stine’s cab could be readily identifiable by its dent, I lean toward the theory that Stine did, in fact, know Z.

That was Paul’s cab that night, but did he always drive the same cab? Or were there a fleet of cabs that were assigned to drivers on a nightly basis.

While it is interesting about him riding in the front seat, imagine you’re a day-to-day cabbie. A strange man hauls you and immediately sits in the front and tells you he’s going 4 blocks. How hard do you protest? I don’t think it’s too likely you tell him "no buddy, back seat only."