Would be interesting to know what happened to his files! And who that guy(?) was who came to his door.

Wallace Penny(I will PM you his real name)

That was him? I know Graysmith talks about him, but I didn’t remember him mentioning Morrill.

Would be interesting to know what happened to his files! And who that guy(?) was who came to his door.

Wallace Penny(I will PM you his real name)

That was him? I know Graysmith talks about him, but I didn’t remember him mentioning Morrill.

Yeah, he showed up with his Wife at Sherwood’s house

That F alone makes me confident I know that Zodiac wrote that desktop poem, it’s that perfect a match from top to bottom, 1st stroke to last

My F looks just like that, too.

It’s also not a perfect match as the middle bar is inflected in one and not in the other, plus the S-like vertical bar starts differently.

Stabbing is so different! I think he wrote on the door because he probably wasn’t comfortable writing letters–not as easy to fake or analyze.

And yet he, this alleged copy-cat, was somehow able to write a Zodiac-like message on a car door, one that totally convinced California’s top handwriting analyst the automotive missive was written by the actual Zodiac.

I’m pretty sure doing what he did with the car door, assuming a copy-cat, would be a lot harder to do than taking days or weeks to fake a letter.

Yeah, he showed up with his Wife at Sherwood’s house

Yike. His wife must have been one attractive "woeman"–or should I say "whoa – man"…

That F alone makes me confident I know that Zodiac wrote that desktop poem, it’s that perfect a match from top to bottom, 1st stroke to last

My F looks just like that, too.

It’s also not a perfect match as the middle bar is inflected in one and not in the other, plus the S-like vertical bar starts differently.

Of course it is, I didn’t expect anything different

That F alone makes me confident I know that Zodiac wrote that desktop poem, it’s that perfect a match from top to bottom, 1st stroke to last

My F looks just like that, too.

It’s also not a perfect match as the middle bar is inflected in one and not in the other, plus the S-like vertical bar starts differently.

And while I understand the center line being a bit off in sz, I think etching/writing on wood vs crouched on a car door, is going to make it look a bit different. But it’s the bottom or tail that convinces me where I put the red line, they both end identically. Again, I am confident in my belief which makes me feel good about the Riverside link. I won’t debate it anymore, as it’s a drain. Everybody should think what they want. I see it, and it matches the state expert’s opinion. I’ll take his trained professional eye and my own 20/20 eyes over somebody else’s

I hear ya morf, and I get what you’re saying.

BTW, If anyone wants a few PDFs I found regarding forensic document examination, let me know.

I’m reading one now which has already, within the first chapter or so, taught me quite a few new interesting things.

The top of the desktop "f" is quite hooked. Similar…yah, the same? Not so much, imo. Several examples of that f from various POI’s have been shared.

I’m all for reading anything about forensics joberson. My next class…can’t wait:

Biology 115-01 Forensics
This course is an introduction to forensic science. Topics covered include trace evidence analysis; forensic entomology, botany and geology; blood and spatter analysis; DNA; forensic anthropology and odontology; arson and explosives; and computer forensics. Laboratory exercises will employ the scientific method and teach microscopic and laboratory techniques, as well as trace evidence and proper data collection and analysis. Experiments will correlate with aspects of forensic science and biotechnology discussed in lecture. The laboratory course will culminate in students using their acquired skills to process a mock crime scene.

Would be interesting to know what happened to his files! And who that guy(?) was who came to his door.

Wallace Penny(I will PM you his real name)

Could you please also PM the name ?

I’ve said before – and I know it’s quite an unpopular opinion – that Morrill couldn’t find a ham sandwich that he wouldn’t authenticate as Zodiac’s. I don’t trust his verification(s). I never have.

I’ve got nothing to show about this as evidence. It’s my opinion. Same as anyone else’s.

-glurk

It’s your opinion, but may I ask what you base it on? Are you aware of several failures or questionable findings by Morrill?

Can I do an analogy? (I will use numerology)

Me: Yes, but he is only a numerologist, and that’s pseudoscience, at best.
Opponent: It’s true that he is a numerologist, but he is a State-Certified EXPERT numerologist.
Me: I don’t care if he is a State-Certified palm reader, it’s not science. It’s one man’s word, and it is mere opinion.
Opponent: But he was State-Certified, that must count for something!
Me: Um, no.

That’s about what I have to say about Numerology, Graphology, Palmistry, and Pseudoscience in general.

-glurk

EDIT: Wasn’t the process of drowning Witches state-certified in Salem, MA.? I think it was.

I really don’t mean to be a pain-in-the-whatever, but "Handwriting Analysis" or "Graphology" is just – NOT – a real science. It just is not.

It’s a man’s opinion being taken as evidence because he stayed at the job long enough to be considered an "expert."

Back then, in the 1960’s, it was all that was available. No DNA, etc. But I take it for what it was.

Has anyone – EVER – been convicted of a crime based on handwriting? No? Anyone, Bueller? Anyone?

-glurk

EDIT: "Handwriting analysis unfortunately is one of the softer comparative forensic procedures that’s widely hailed by law enforcement advocates but enjoys little support based on independent testing of field results. According to a recent academic analysis published earlier this year by Paul Gianelli of Case Western Law School:" –> http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm? … id=1083735

"A review of five handwriting comparison proficiency tests in 1987 showed that, at best, “document examiners were correct 57% of the time and incorrect 43% of the time.”

And so on.

So I guess, no handwriting expert in your opinion, no writing experts are worth anything?

I really don’t mean to be a pain-in-the-whatever, but "Handwriting Analysis" or "Graphology" is just – NOT – a real science. It just is not.

It’s a man’s opinion being taken as evidence because he stayed at the job long enough to be considered an "expert."

Back then, in the 1960’s, it was all that was available. No DNA, etc. But I take it for what it was.

Has anyone – EVER – been convicted of a crime based on handwriting? No? Anyone, Bueller? Anyone?

-glurk

EDIT: "Handwriting analysis unfortunately is one of the softer comparative forensic procedures that’s widely hailed by law enforcement advocates but enjoys little support based on independent testing of field results. According to a recent academic analysis published earlier this year by Paul Gianelli of Case Western Law School:" –> http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm? … id=1083735

"A review of five handwriting comparison proficiency tests in 1987 showed that, at best, “document examiners were correct 57% of the time and incorrect 43% of the time.”

And so on.

Handwriting analysis/document examination does play a big role in forgery cases. Many times these are civil cases involving wills, contracts or insurance scams so may not garner the attention a criminal case would.

May not be a science, but people go to jail or avoid jail based in part on handwriting examination